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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Chess Architecture (Read 4409 times)
curmudgeon39
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #11 - 01/24/19 at 14:42:30
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Yury Markushin is not a GM. He is a USCF rated National Elo 1949. Sorry for the error.
  
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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #10 - 01/24/19 at 13:08:46
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normative
  
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Jupp53
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #9 - 01/24/19 at 07:59:33
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Marcellus wrote on 01/23/19 at 15:05:26:
Markushin is definitely not a GM.

while Norman is in his field.

A question, as I will read the paper later after some other stuff: Is the model normative, i.e. tells it how you should think, or is it empirical, i.e. based on how chess players think and humans think over all? If it is normative it would be the first model working for humans.
  

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Marcellus
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #8 - 01/23/19 at 15:05:26
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Markushin is definitely not a GM.
  
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curmudgeon39
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #7 - 01/23/19 at 14:57:02
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The Seven stages of Action are well established by Donald Norman in the Design of Everyday Things. The principles of Chess strategy are derived from chess Grand Masters Igor Smirnov and Yury Markushin and they are cited on the paper.   
  
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an ordinary chessplayer
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #6 - 01/19/19 at 19:24:43
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I'm not discounting it. But I have some very specific criticisms.

1. It is quite abstract. For me it calls to mind the 7 layers of the OSI model. The OSI model *classifies* all the steps, but real-world implementations do not *necessarily* follow the model. What is lacking in the paper is tying the Chess Architecture model to real-world thinking about chess positions. It needs lots of examples, annotated with thinking that follows the model. The 1.e4 e5 tables on pages 4-5 are just a toy example, and not very well done either, as pointed out by RdC.

2. It makes claims for results which are completely unfounded.

Quote:
The planning levels exist simultaneously outside of time but are executed in sequence in time. The mind is capable of thinking about all previous positions on the chess board at any time using the brain's memory. So if the positon [sic] on the board does not change significantly or you anticipate moves ahead of them actually occurring, you do not need to go through all seven steps of action, you can act immediately or at any level based on prior knowledge or anticipated actions. But to create a good habit it is best to go through the entire cycle on each move.
--page 2
Well actually it's not at all certain that the seven steps are a good habit to cultivate. That's the sort of claim that needs evidence to back it up.

Quote:
Principles of Chess Strategy guide and constrain the selection of candidate moves. They will improve your play dramatically, save you time in selecting from fewer and prioritized candidate moves and their calculation, and point you toward only the best candidate moves.
--page 28
This is an even more sweeping claim, and it just begs for some examples of before and after usage of the Principles.

Overall I found the proposed thinking model(s) interesting, but unconvincing as a results-oriented plan of action. My own knowledge of practical psychology, as well as my own experience of what is required to find a good chess move, speaks against the method. So I would like to see some, ideally many, real chess examples analyzed before I seriously engage with the ideas presented.
  
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curmudgeon39
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #5 - 01/19/19 at 16:03:40
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My level of chess play is what caused me to realize I have a lot of bad habits that I wish I could overcome. As an engineer I decided to see if my experience in Enterprise ARchitecture might apply to chess. Please read the paper before and think about it before you discount it.
  
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RdC
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #4 - 01/18/19 at 09:30:06
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phonological_loop wrote on 01/18/19 at 04:21:37:
More substantively, do we have any evidence that top players think in anything like these terms, or that this thought process is beneficial?


The paper recommends 1. e4 on the grounds that it releases the Queen and a Bishop. I'm inclined to think "so what". 1.d4 leaves the pawn defended by the Queen, whilst 1. c4 and 1. Nf3 are less committal as to where the central pawns go.

Perhaps the paper reflects the chess understanding of someone not capable of playing to a higher level than 1400.

From playing at a 2000 level for fifty years, I would say my basic evaluation is to count the pieces and pawns. That's an advantage to the side having more of them unless there are special features. Evaluating "special" features can be the difficult part.
  
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #3 - 01/18/19 at 05:28:41
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To be fair, it would seem that the author has been as high as 1401.

  
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phonological_loop
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #2 - 01/18/19 at 04:21:37
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It is somewhat odd to read an article about the "key to playing chess at a consistently high level" written by a 1350 rated player (according to the USCF player database).

More substantively, do we have any evidence that top players think in anything like these terms, or that this thought process is beneficial?

Typically when one writes an academic paper, it begins with a survey of existing work and an identification of the novel methodological contribution. I do not see any discussion of prior work here, which is again odd, because quite a bit has been written about the chess thought process.
  
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Re: Chess Architecture
Reply #1 - 01/14/19 at 13:26:12
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Do people really follow a move procedure on every move? Like the 'Chess Architecture'?

I have tried to follow different move selection guides, but not with a great success. When the game start to be sharp and tense, I often forget do the move selection steps.


  
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GMTonyKosten
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Chess Architecture
01/14/19 at 10:19:59
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There is a free paper on 'Chess Architecture' by Keith McCaughin to download: https://www.chesspublishing.com/content/chess_architecture.htm
Discussion here, please.
  
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