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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Install Lc0? (Read 440 times)
Leon_Trotsky
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #18 - yesterday at 22:03:16
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As I speak, I have Leela running for two hours. It lags the whole system, that some webpages cannot even load because it seems to make my internet connection slower. Chrome and Microsoft Edge sometimes crash when Leela runs due to its lag.

I think that to not have this slowness, you need very heavy duty laptop. Perhaps even those gaming laptops or similar. Otherwise it is hard to do anything like browsing when Leela runs for long times.
  
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Pawnpusher
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #17 - yesterday at 10:34:28
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I am not the best person to reply, but the short answer is that a "Monte Carlo" search like LcO uses is a different breed of animal. Each node there is based on different calculation (Monte Carlo search ) than Stockfish which is based on an evaluation that is basically written out by a human. So there are differences. People use LcO because it is a top competitor in TCEC, and many people think machine learning is the future of computer chess.
  
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msiipola
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #16 - yesterday at 10:29:36
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I have reinstalled Lc0 (v0.21.1) and compared it with Stockfish 10 64bit, with same position.

Lc0: 20 kN/s, after 1 min: Depth=15
SF: 11700 kN/s, after 1 min: Depth=32
  
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msiipola
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #15 - yesterday at 10:02:27
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I have deleted my Lc0 installation, so I can't give any figures now.

But I'm confused when you say a normal (?) ratio between Stockfish and Lc0 is 1000:1. Do you mean Stockfish should be 1000 times faster then Lc0?! If I'm correct, why should anybody use Lc0, if it's 1000 slower then Stockfish?

  
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fling
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #14 - yesterday at 08:42:51
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msiipola wrote yesterday at 06:27:35:
As I told before, I have a quite high performance GPU Nividia GTX1080, and also got Lc0 to execute.
But it was much slower then Stockfish, and I don't see any reason to use Lc0. But maybe the Lc0 installation could have been tweaked in some way, I don't know.


As you may have noticed, slow is a subjective evaluation. What do you mean by much slower? The nps is lower for basically all setups. From what I've seen, a suitable ratio between Stockfish and Lc0 is around 1000:1 for nps to have somewhat fair evaluation of their respective playing strength.

The relevant question for you is rather looking at published benchmarks. I'd say you should probably end up at around 4-5 nps with a GTX 1080. Is your setup much slower than that?
  
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msiipola
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #13 - yesterday at 06:27:35
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As I told before, I have a quite high performance GPU Nividia GTX1080, and also got Lc0 to execute.
But it was much slower then Stockfish, and I don't see any reason to use Lc0. But maybe the Lc0 installation could have been tweaked in some way, I don't know.
  
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fling
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #12 - 08/16/19 at 05:16:28
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JFugre wrote on 08/15/19 at 18:40:49:
fling wrote on 08/15/19 at 12:31:01:
msiipola wrote on 08/15/19 at 06:23:26:
I manage to get the Lc0 running before (without any driver changes), but it was very very slow. If this was install problem or not, I don't know.


What hardware to you have? If you don't own a good GPU (that fully supports fp16, which basically are the RTX cards), Lc0 will only run at a few nps at the most.


That's a vast exaggeration, it's still a few thousand for recent non-RTX GPUs. With an RTX it's over ten thousand. With a GTX 1060 or faster the engine is still really strong at like 3-4knps.

You do need a reasonably modern, non-mobile NVIDIA GPU or it's not worth bothering with. But not necessarily an RTX card. If you have a choice though, obviously do get an RTX!


Well, my mistake, I wrote "few nps" but of course meant knps.

The comment was only "but it was very very slow", which I interpreted in terms of nps, but may very well mean something else.
  
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Leon_Trotsky
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #11 - 08/15/19 at 22:28:19
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Leela creates a lot of lag when turned on for hours.

I think that if you really need Leela on for long times, you need to activate "high performance" on the battery settings.
  
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JFugre
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #10 - 08/15/19 at 18:40:49
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fling wrote on 08/15/19 at 12:31:01:
msiipola wrote on 08/15/19 at 06:23:26:
I manage to get the Lc0 running before (without any driver changes), but it was very very slow. If this was install problem or not, I don't know.


What hardware to you have? If you don't own a good GPU (that fully supports fp16, which basically are the RTX cards), Lc0 will only run at a few nps at the most.


That's a vast exaggeration, it's still a few thousand for recent non-RTX GPUs. With an RTX it's over ten thousand. With a GTX 1060 or faster the engine is still really strong at like 3-4knps.

You do need a reasonably modern, non-mobile NVIDIA GPU or it's not worth bothering with. But not necessarily an RTX card. If you have a choice though, obviously do get an RTX!
  
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JFugre
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #9 - 08/15/19 at 18:38:03
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Pawnpusher wrote on 08/15/19 at 10:05:24:
Really to install you need the LcO and a network. You may need to rename the network file to weights from there you're pretty much home free.

You don't need to rename weights files. The engine scans all files in the dir and picks the most recent file that is a valid weight.
  
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fling
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #8 - 08/15/19 at 12:31:01
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msiipola wrote on 08/15/19 at 06:23:26:
I manage to get the Lc0 running before (without any driver changes), but it was very very slow. If this was install problem or not, I don't know.


What hardware to you have? If you don't own a good GPU (that fully supports fp16, which basically are the RTX cards), Lc0 will only run at a few nps at the most.
  
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Pawnpusher
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #7 - 08/15/19 at 10:05:24
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Really to install you need the LcO and a network. You may need to rename the network file to weights from there you're pretty much home free.
  
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msiipola
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #6 - 08/15/19 at 06:23:26
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Maybe I'm going to try again. But what is lacking is a easy to understand install instructions. At least I haven't found any.

I manage to get the Lc0 running before (without any driver changes), but it was very very slow. If this was install problem or not, I don't know.

I confess I should educate myself more on this subject, what neural is etc. But I tried to avoid this...  Smiley
  
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JFugre
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #5 - 08/13/19 at 11:36:38
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msiipola wrote on 08/11/19 at 07:01:11:
I was interested in using Lc0, but I found I had to install new/other graphic drivers for my Nvidia card (GTX 1080).

Nvidia has recently updated drivers with security fixes, and if I'm going to use drivers for Lc0, I'm not sure they contain same updates. And I get new updates of Nvidia drivers quite often.


Lc0 just needs the latest release driver from NVIDIA (which would have the security fixes). All the extra CUDA stuff you need is bundled with the lc0 download.

There is no need for "special" drivers.

Quote:
get the lastest CUDA version,


There is no need to install CUDA separately. NVIDIA's drivers include base support and everything else you need is in lc0's CUDA package.

Installing lc0 is marginally more complicated than Stockfish but I have the impression a lot people are confused and doing extra things that are totally necessary, making it look even more complicated.
  
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Pawnpusher
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Re: Install Lc0?
Reply #4 - 08/13/19 at 11:04:17
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That is pretty much the procedure I followed.
  
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