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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin (Read 7391 times)
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #14 - 06/08/20 at 19:43:47
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So... now that some time has passed, how do you experienced Nimzo players feel about the repertoire?  Would you recommend it?  Just curious.
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #13 - 03/31/20 at 22:16:39
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BobbyDigital80 wrote on 02/24/20 at 23:06:39:
Is there any way to liven this line up if Black wants to avoid the perpetual and play for a win?

1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.Bg5 h6 6.Bxf6 Qxf6 7.e3 O-O 8.Rc1 dxc4 9.Bxc4 c5 10.0-0 cxd4 11.Nxd4 Bd7 12.Qb3 Nc6 13.Nxc6 Bxc3 14.Rxc3 Bxc6 15.Bb5 Bd5=

Are there decent alternatives to 9...c5?


If you have the repertoire they suggest to take a look at 8...c6 "if you're desperate to avoid a draw". Although there doesn't seem to be anything majorly wrong with, 8...c6 or 8...Nd7 for that matter, 9...c5 in the given line is so principled and natural that everything else is still probably going to be objectively a little worse.
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #12 - 03/31/20 at 21:45:34
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Syzygy wrote on 10/18/19 at 18:17:06:
fling wrote on 10/18/19 at 06:54:33:
Syzygy wrote on 10/17/19 at 20:09:24:
In the Ragozin, do they consider the line:

5. Qa4+ Nc6 6. e3 O-O 7. Bd2 dxc4 8. Bxc4 Bd6 9. Qc2 e5 10. dxe5 Nxe5 11. Nxe5 Bxe5 12. O-O-O Qe7 13. Kb1? Or do they recommend 9...a6 instead? I've always found it somewhat annoying to find equality in this variation as Black.


It is in there. 13...Rb8 14.f4 Bxc3 15. Bxc3 Bg4 16. Rxd8 Rxd8 with equality is the conclusion.


After 13...Rd8, 14. Bd3 is more critical than 14. f4. Looking at the line again, however, it seems 14. Bd3 Bd7 should be sufficient for Black.


I bought the chessable repertoire a week ago since I wanted to learn about the Ragozin. Today is the first day looking at it and fortunately I find this thread on chesspub.

I find it interesting that in the Qa5+ variation above, Black surrenders the center with dxc4 and moves the bishop again by Bb4-d6, nevertheless, the moves are logical.

Looking somewhat superficially at the position from the chessable repertoire after 13...Rd8 14.f4 Bxc3 15. Bxc3 Bg4 16. Rxd8 Rxd8, I felt a little uncomfortable at first White's bishop pair. The conclusion in the chessable repertoire is that "Black has equalised here comfortably. Next he can work on eliminating white's bishop pair by playing either ...Be6 or ...Ne4."

I checked a few lines myself and can confirm Black should be equal due to being able to control and occupy the e5-square, thus immobilizing White's d- and e-pawns as well as having good board control and coordination of his pieces.

Pasting some example lines:

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 d5 4. Nc3 Bb4 5. Qa4+ Nc6 6. e3 O-O 7. Bd2 dxc4 8.Bxc4 Bd6 9. Qc2 e5 10. dxe5 Nxe5 11. Nxe5 Bxe5 12. O-O-O Qe7 13. Kb1 Rd8 14. f4 (14. Bd3) 14... Bxc3 15. Bxc3 Bg4 16. Rxd8+ Rxd8 17. h3 (17. Re1 Ne4 18. Bd3 Bf5 19. Ka1 h5) 17... Bd7 18. Bd4 (18. Be5 Bc6 19. Ka1 Be4 20. Bxf6 gxf6 21. Qe2) 18... Bc6 19. Ka1 Be4 20. Qc3 Nd5 21. Bxd5 Rxd5 22. Rg1 (22. Rc1 f6 23. Qxc7 Qxc7 24. Rxc7 Bxg2) (22. Bxg7 Rd3 23. Qe5 Qxe5 24. Bxe5) 22... f6 23. Rc1 c6

14.Bd3 as suggested by Syzygy and equally 14.f3 may be worth looking a bit at, both with the idea of e3-e4.
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #11 - 02/24/20 at 23:06:39
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Is there any way to liven this line up if Black wants to avoid the perpetual and play for a win?

1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.Bg5 h6 6.Bxf6 Qxf6 7.e3 O-O 8.Rc1 dxc4 9.Bxc4 c5 10.0-0 cxd4 11.Nxd4 Bd7 12.Qb3 Nc6 13.Nxc6 Bxc3 14.Rxc3 Bxc6 15.Bb5 Bd5=

Are there decent alternatives to 9...c5?
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #10 - 10/18/19 at 18:17:06
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fling wrote on 10/18/19 at 06:54:33:
Syzygy wrote on 10/17/19 at 20:09:24:
In the Ragozin, do they consider the line:

5. Qa4+ Nc6 6. e3 O-O 7. Bd2 dxc4 8. Bxc4 Bd6 9. Qc2 e5 10. dxe5 Nxe5 11. Nxe5 Bxe5 12. O-O-O Qe7 13. Kb1? Or do they recommend 9...a6 instead? I've always found it somewhat annoying to find equality in this variation as Black.


It is in there. 13...Rb8 14.f4 Bxc3 15. Bxc3 Bg4 16. Rxd8 Rxd8 with equality is the conclusion.


After 13...Rd8, 14. Bd3 is more critical than 14. f4. Looking at the line again, however, it seems 14. Bd3 Bd7 should be sufficient for Black.
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #9 - 10/18/19 at 06:54:33
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Syzygy wrote on 10/17/19 at 20:09:24:
In the Ragozin, do they consider the line:

5. Qa4+ Nc6 6. e3 O-O 7. Bd2 dxc4 8. Bxc4 Bd6 9. Qc2 e5 10. dxe5 Nxe5 11. Nxe5 Bxe5 12. O-O-O Qe7 13. Kb1? Or do they recommend 9...a6 instead? I've always found it somewhat annoying to find equality in this variation as Black.


It is in there. 13...Rd8 14.f4 Bxc3 15. Bxc3 Bg4 16. Rxd8 Rxd8 with equality is the conclusion.
« Last Edit: 10/18/19 at 22:32:03 by fling »  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #8 - 10/18/19 at 06:44:49
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Stigma wrote on 10/17/19 at 21:28:03:
Still within 4.e3, any hint on what they give against 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 O-O 5.Bd3 followed by 6.Nge2?

That line annoys me a bit as it seems Black's choices are a lot narrower than they are after either 5.Nge2 or 5.Bd3/6.Nf3. Basically "everybody" says Black should go for an IQP position after 6.Nge2, but I would love to avoid that or at least have a choice in the matter...


From what I have seen, they give 5. Bd3 d5 6. Nge2 dxc4, with the follow up ...c5. I.e. there will often be an IQP position, with the idea that the knight on e2 is misplaced as it would be better on f2.

There is a note saying Black can play ...e5 instead, but that is not necessary as ...c5 is fine for Black.
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #7 - 10/17/19 at 21:28:03
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Still within 4.e3, any hint on what they give against 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 O-O 5.Bd3 followed by 6.Nge2?

That line annoys me a bit as it seems Black's choices are a lot narrower than they are after either 5.Nge2 or 5.Bd3/6.Nf3. Basically "everybody" says Black should go for an IQP position after 6.Nge2, but I would love to avoid that or at least have a choice in the matter...
  

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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #6 - 10/17/19 at 20:09:24
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In the Ragozin, do they consider the line:

5. Qa4+ Nc6 6. e3 O-O 7. Bd2 dxc4 8. Bxc4 Bd6 9. Qc2 e5 10. dxe5 Nxe5 11. Nxe5 Bxe5 12. O-O-O Qe7 13. Kb1? Or do they recommend 9...a6 instead? I've always found it somewhat annoying to find equality in this variation as Black.
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #5 - 10/17/19 at 16:15:39
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MNb wrote on 10/17/19 at 14:42:53:
Someone has forgotten 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 O-O 5.Bd3 d5 6.Nf3 c5


They play b6:

1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 O-O 5.Bd3 d5 6.Nf3 b6
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #4 - 10/17/19 at 15:23:43
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an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 10/17/19 at 14:30:49:
Just checking: G.A.S. = Gadget Acquisition Syndrome?



Gear, Gadget, whatever. In this case: chessbooks! (And DVD's etc)
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #3 - 10/17/19 at 15:23:07
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One interesting line (Note the choice of 5. .. c5, which is due to simplicity reasons) is:

1.d4 Nf6
2.c4 e6 3.Nc3
3...Bb4
4.Qc2 O-O 5.Nf3
5...c5
6.dxc5 Na6 7.g3 Nxc5 8.Bg2 Nce4 9.O-O Nxc3 10.bxc3 Be7 11.e4 d6 12.e5 dxe5 13.Nxe5 Qc7 14.Qe2 Bd6


Which he gives as equal. I'm not sure, I think that's a bit fishy (read: Stockfish does indeed give 0.0 here). Black seems to do more than fine in practice, so that's an argument for. Maybe something like:

15.Bf4 Ne8 16.c5 Qxc5 17.c4 Qc7 18.Rab1 f6 19.Nd3 Rb8 20.c5 Bxf4 21.Nxf4 Qxc5 22.Nxe6 Qe7 23.Rfe1 Bxe6 24.Qxe6+ Qxe6 25.Rxe6
  
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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #2 - 10/17/19 at 14:42:53
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Someone has forgotten 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 O-O 5.Bd3 d5 6.Nf3 c5 and 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nf3 Bb4 5.e3 O-O 6.Bd3 c5. Is it you or the authors? This variation is not entirely irrelevant.
  

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Re: Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
Reply #1 - 10/17/19 at 14:30:49
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Just checking: G.A.S. = Gadget Acquisition Syndrome?
  
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Lifetime Repertoires: The Nimzo-Ragozin
10/17/19 at 12:44:00
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IM Christof Sielecki and FM Daniel Barrish have a joint repertoire up on Chessable, a general work against 1. d4 and 1. Nf3.

Main choices are the Nimzo and the Ragozin.

There are 2 related Short & Sweet courses, so it's easy to get an overview of the suggested lines:

Nimzo
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Nf3 d5 (transposing)
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Qb3 c5 5.dxc5 Nc6
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Bg5 c5
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.f3 d5 5.a3 Bxc3+ 6.bxc3 c5 7.cxd5 Nxd5 8.dxc5 f5
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.e3 O-O 5.Nge2 d5 6.a3 Be7
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Qc2 O-O 5.e4 d5 6.e5 Ne4 7.Bd3 c5
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4 4.Qc2 O-O 5.Nf3 c5

Ragozin
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.Bg5 h6 6.Bh4 dxc4
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.Bg5 h6 6.Bxf6 Qxf6 7.e3 O-O 8.Rc1 dxc4 9.Bxc4 c5
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.cxd5 exd5 6.Qa4+ Nc6 7.Ne5 a5
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.Qb3 c5
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 Bb4+ 4.Nc3 d5 5.Qa4+ Nc6 6.e3 O-O 7.Qc2 b6
1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 Bb4+ 4.Nc3 d5 5.Qa4+ Nc6 6.e3 O-O 7.Bd2 dxc4 8.Bxc4 Bd6

AFAIK they play Bb4 against the Catalan as well, as well as cover the usual sidelines.

I'm curious if anyone has the repertoire or any thoughts on it. I'd have been pretty ecstatic to see something like this say a year ago, but now my mood is much more tempered. I found the Nimzo really hard to study, as white has many viable setups requiring separate treatment, and many lines are very concrete. Even if one chooses second rate/unusual lines, like Sielecki did in his previous Nimzo repertoire, there end up still being quite a few approaches and exceptions to learn. And then you need something against everything else still! So despite my G.A.S. wrt chess books, I might manage to convince myself to not get this.

Unless someone here confirms this is the bee's knees.

  
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