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Normal Topic The Modernized Stonewall Defense (Read 2963 times)
TD
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #8 - 06/22/20 at 08:57:07
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Pavlovic doesn't even mention the move-order 7.b3 Qe7 8.Bb2... I find that very strange.
  
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brabo
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #7 - 03/11/20 at 15:22:10
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MartinC wrote on 03/11/20 at 09:50:18:
The problem with LCO's refutations is that they don't tend to rely on the sort of really specific things that the ones that Stockfish produces do.

Rather it tends to produce quite 'simple' things that squash counterplay and give an nice safe edge.

You nail it. I recently encountered some positions which are probably still defendable but it takes very high skills without any realistic counterplay. That is the optimistic case as I've also seen positions which I doubt it can be saved with even very high skills. Anyway I only work for 5 months with Lc0 and there are still many things I still need to investigate.
  
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MartinC
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #6 - 03/11/20 at 09:50:18
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The problem with LCO's refutations is that they don't tend to rely on the sort of really specific things that the ones that Stockfish produces do.

Rather it tends to produce quite 'simple' things that squash counterplay and give an nice safe edge.
  
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motörhead
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #5 - 03/10/20 at 22:56:43
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brabo wrote on 03/10/20 at 08:16:24:
Still in practice I notice none of my opponents have done a serious analysis of the stonewall. Some of them were rated +2450 fide and were IMs and GMs so clearly not the average amateur. I guess it is because almost nobody plays it regularly anymore so it is only used as a surprise-weapon. In most games I just get sidelines on the board like 1.d4 f5 2.Bg5 or 1.d4 f5 2.Nc3 ... which are no refutation.


Well observed - even if I don't have too deep knowledge about Stonewall-theory at all Cheesy.
But I think your observation can be transfered on most many "unsound" openings.
Objectivelly there may be AI-checked refutiations in them. But the normal chessplayers don't know them, don't know exact move orders, as they have no time for research.
So they play human chess and open way for interesting play.
That you gamble, playing those "unsound" openings is a purist's look from the outside in.

The Problem that rises more and more, is that ascending AI may make more and more openings look less and less attractive, thus cutting down our choices.
In the distant end the whole game seems threatened - who will continue to play a solved game?!
  

A walk trough the ocean of most souls would scarcely get your feet wet.
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TD
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #4 - 03/10/20 at 08:34:39
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brabo wrote on 03/10/20 at 08:16:24:
Also the introduction talks about "the 'modern' approach with ...Dd6". I guess they mean ...Bd6.

The excerpt says Bd6 (with a figurine).
  
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brabo
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #3 - 03/10/20 at 08:16:24
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I only found one blitzgame in the database from Milos Pavlovic with the stonewall. Also the introduction talks about "the 'modern' approach with ...Dd6". I guess they mean ...Bd6.
That are 2 good reasons for me already not to buy the book.

I am more interested in the book of Nicola Sedlak scheduled this summer about the stonewall https://www.qualitychess.co.uk/products/12/368/playing_the_stonewall_dutch_hardc.... He is a real expert in it although I am very much afraid that also he won't be able to rescue the opening.

Especially with Lc0 and his neural network friends, it looks like recently game over for the stonewall. There are everywhere new problems popping up. I am not talking about the Reti/English setups which were already before a dead end but about the hardcore mainlines. If I give up the opening completely then I will publish a few of those refutations on my blog.

Still in practice I notice none of my opponents have done a serious analysis of the stonewall. Some of them were rated +2450 fide and were IMs and GMs so clearly not the average amateur. I guess it is because almost nobody plays it regularly anymore so it is only used as a surprise-weapon. In most games I just get sidelines on the board like 1.d4 f5 2.Bg5 or 1.d4 f5 2.Nc3 ... which are no refutation.
  
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #2 - 03/09/20 at 17:27:29
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If I recall correctly, brabo doesn't like the Stonewall Dutch anymore because of Reti/English options - do we know if either of the upcoming books cover these lines? This isn't a problem for people who play the Sicilian, who can always play the Symmetrical English after 1 c4 and 1 Nf3.
  
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Re: The Modernized Stonewall Defense
Reply #1 - 03/09/20 at 16:48:13
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TD wrote on 03/09/20 at 14:38:52:
A new book on the Stonewall by Thinkers Publishing!

https://www.debestezet.nl/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=4440

How interesting. Our very own Brabo appears to have lost faith in the opening, yet Thinkers Publishing and Quality Chess both have books coming out this summer.
  

"As Mikhail Tal would say ' Let's have a bit of hooliganism! '"

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TD
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The Modernized Stonewall Defense
03/09/20 at 14:38:52
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A new book on the Stonewall by Thinkers Publishing!

https://www.debestezet.nl/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=4440
  
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