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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Simeonidis on Neo-Møller (Read 2140 times)
grandpatzer
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #13 - 01/20/21 at 20:16:30
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Konstriktor wrote on 01/20/21 at 11:22:19:
Vs. The Exchange with 5.0-0 he gives 5...Bg4


Thank you.
  
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Konstriktor
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #12 - 01/20/21 at 11:22:19
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I got the book via forwardchess (for 13 euro).
The variations are very concrete, which I guess is the way things are with modern chess.
It's a pretty recent variation, so it is "only" 160 pages with about 100 pages covering the 5...Bc5 move.
Vs 8.dxe5 he gives the 2018 Karjakin-Carlsen game with the fantastic manoeuvre 14... Bg4 en 15...Bf5!!

I played this position from 15...Bf5 on chess.com with black recently in a 5 day-per-move game.
It's pretty hard to play for both sides I think, but with black you are a pawn down and you have to play actively on the kingside with ...h6-...g5 which is something you have to get used too I guess.

Vs. The Exchange with 5.0-0 he gives 5...Bg4

The book ends with 47 exercises.

Overall I think it's a nice well researched book which gives you a good overview of a young variation. I think the Simeonidis quote on the 8.Bg5 more or less sums op the character of the play in many variations :

"The position is too complicated even for engines and no human player wants to take such a risk unless he knows what he is doing. But if the human player knows the position is sound and knows how to counter white threats, the idea of catching the opponent unprepared in such a mess is very appealing"

  
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Tauromachie
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #11 - 01/20/21 at 09:30:52
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How does he deal with the ending arising after 8.dxe5 ? Is there a clear path to equalize?
  
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grandpatzer
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #10 - 01/20/21 at 08:38:13
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To those who have the book by now, I was wondering what is the suggested line vs. the Exchange Ruy.
  
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Stigma
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #9 - 12/11/20 at 11:23:18
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Bibs wrote on 12/11/20 at 08:37:43:
No idea who originated it. @kylemeister, you are suggesting this is not correct, as stated? In Neo's style, can you enlighten?


His name was Jørgen Møller.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J%C3%B8rgen_M%C3%B8ller

According to the FIDE rating list, Anders Møller is a contemporary player born 1989 and rated 1420. A bit embarrasing that New in Chess didn't catch the mix-up.
  

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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #8 - 12/11/20 at 08:37:43
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Good to see that the author explained the reason behind the 'Neo-'. And it's seemingly nothing Matrix-related. A switch in move order. An interesting intro to the book, in fact.

No idea who originated it. @kylemeister, you are suggesting this is not correct, as stated? In Neo's style, can you enlighten?

  
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #7 - 12/10/20 at 22:20:15
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I see that Simeonidis refers to "the originator of this line, Anders Møller" (nope).
  
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tracke
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #6 - 12/10/20 at 19:10:14
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Now the announcement is online again -
and already in the „What‘s New“ section:

https://www.newinchess.com/carlsen-s-neo-moller

tracke  Smiley
  
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #5 - 12/05/20 at 11:32:10
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Stigma wrote on 12/04/20 at 20:28:42:
I also remember concluding after some quick, lazy database/engine research that White could cause serious problems.

I analysed this line some years ago, but whenever I tried to play it my (very strong GM) opponents avoided it with early d3 lines.
I think it is quite playable, the one line that bothered me was 6 Nxe5 Nxe5 7 d4 b5 8 dxe5 (8 Bb3 transposes to the Yurtaev line and is fine for Black after 8...Bxd4) 8...Nxe4 9 Bb3 Bb7 10 Bd5 when Black has to take on f2 and go into a position of rook and pawn against two pieces. I analysed this in a 'DW' book, and computers seem to quite like it for Black, but I wouldn't actually fancy playing it OTB myself! Undecided
  
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #4 - 12/05/20 at 08:58:31
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AlanG wrote on 12/04/20 at 13:21:56:
TopNotch wrote on 12/04/20 at 00:16:44:
I played this system for about a year and had lots of fun with it, but objectively its very close to losing by force and very difficult to handle if White knows the critical line. BTW I think Ivan Sokolov did some impressive groundwork in his now forgotten but excellent book  The Ruy Lopez Revisited: Offbeat Weapons & Unexplored Resources.

I wonder if you are thinking of the line with 3...Bc5 instead of 3...a6 ?


I was speaking from memory so you could be right. I will double check to confirm and post back.

EDIT: You are absolutely correct, I got the source wrong, but stand by my assessment as very close to lost.
« Last Edit: 12/05/20 at 19:28:01 by TopNotch »  

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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #3 - 12/04/20 at 20:28:42
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tracke wrote on 12/03/20 at 15:13:53:

Carlsen‘s Neo-Møller
A Complete and Surprising Repertoire against the Ruy Lopez
by FM Ioannis Simeonidis
New in Chess ; 160 pages ; 23 € ; December 15th 2020

It‘s about 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.0-0 Bc5 (6.c3 0-0 7.d4 Ba7 8.d4 & 8.Bg5).


You have d4 played twice there. But I think I know what you mean.

Thanks for the tip! It's a line I'm interested in, though I also remember concluding after some quick, lazy database/engine research that White could cause serious problems.

P. S.: I'm skeptical of the prefix "Neo-" being right here. As we found out in another thread thanks to kylemeister, Jørgen Møller himself way back in 1903 recommended playing it without an early ...b5. So actually it should be more historically correct to call this the "old", "original" or "real" Møller!

Sources:
https://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/chess/YaBB.pl?num=1326131016/all

Tidskrift för Schack, April 1903:
http://40.91.215.76/pdf/1903/tfs_1903_04.pdf

(Møller's theory article starts on page 84 - page 3 of the pdf. This was digged up by kylemeister in that other thread, but the link there appears broken now; luckily I found another link to the same file.)
  

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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #2 - 12/04/20 at 13:21:56
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TopNotch wrote on 12/04/20 at 00:16:44:
I played this system for about a year and had lots of fun with it, but objectively its very close to losing by force and very difficult to handle if White knows the critical line. BTW I think Ivan Sokolov did some impressive groundwork in his now forgotten but excellent book  The Ruy Lopez Revisited: Offbeat Weapons & Unexplored Resources.

I wonder if you are thinking of the line with 3...Bc5 instead of 3...a6 ?
  
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TopNotch
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Re: Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
Reply #1 - 12/04/20 at 00:16:44
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I played this system for about a year and had lots of fun with it, but objectively its very close to losing by force and very difficult to handle if White knows the critical line. BTW I think Ivan Sokolov did some impressive groundwork in his now forgotten but excellent book  The Ruy Lopez Revisited: Offbeat Weapons & Unexplored Resources.
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
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tracke
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Simeonidis on Neo-Møller
12/03/20 at 15:13:53
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Carlsen‘s Neo-Møller
A Complete and Surprising Repertoire against the Ruy Lopez
by FM Ioannis Simeonidis
New in Chess ; 160 pages ; 23 € ; December 15th 2020

It‘s about 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bb5 a6 4.Ba4 Nf6 5.0-0 Bc5 (6.c3 0-0 7.d4 Ba7 8.d4 & 8.Bg5).
A sideline that has been played by Carlsen, Nabaty, Lysyj, Fressinet, Stefanova and others

https://www.newinchess.com/carlsen-s-neo-moller
There‘s a PDF with ToC, preface, introduction and parts of a theoretical chapter.

tracke  Smiley

PS:
Now the link is broken and the announcement has been removed from the NiC homepage  Sad
Maybe the publication date is postponed ?!
  
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