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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili (Read 5256 times)
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #61 - 06/26/21 at 21:13:32
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LeeRoth wrote on 05/24/21 at 18:08:52:
The coverage of the Rauzer is excellent and makes use of Shankland's own games.  I've gone through most of 6.Bg5 and 6.Bc4, checked the lines with an engine and database, and feel I could play these lines at a decent level.


There are two recent books on the Kozul variation (8...b4). Yermolinksy also covered it in a video series on the ICC. I think it is acceptable for black, but it takes a commitment to master or feel comfortable with the line. Some of the lines are a little long for my tastes, but I can always change my mind.

Shankland proceeds instead with the Spassky (8...Be7) line. If Shankland demonstrates that black is hanging in there, then the book/course is probably worth the time and money from someone who wants to play the Classical. I have not bought this, nor any other, Chessable product. This could be my first purchase. I wonder if ...Be7 theory ends a little sooner than in the ...b5 lines. Perhaps more like a taxi than a train.

The motivation of the Kozul is to retain the option of playing ...Bh6. Obviously 8...Be7 takes the bishop in the opposite direction. Yet while scanning a few games I noticed one where black played Be7, later 0-0-0, Re8, Bf8 and Bh6! Granted this is a long way around. Yet it is a reminder that these two lines are part of a single family. I suspect that if one is comfortable with one, one is likely to be comfortable with the other, and if not comfortable with one, then not comfortable with either.

I think the consensus that the Classical is fine outside of the Richter-Rauzer is correct. The Sozin-Fischer-Velimirovic lines are dangerous, but not an extinction level threat. The evaluation of the Richter-Rauzer is critical to the evaluation of the Classical Sicilian.

I suppose a quick-out is provided by Dubov's 6...g6. The move is hard to believe, as are Dubov's results. In 2021 he played 7 games, winning 4 and drawing 3. 5 opponents were rated above 2700, one above 2600 and one above 2500.

As white I've faced the Dubov line in a couple of speed games. We did not know much theory and I prevailed. However the computer was not impressed, and found messy equality for black after only a few moves.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #60 - 05/27/21 at 14:55:40
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kylemeister wrote on 05/25/21 at 22:45:11:
Regarding this 9. Be2, one recent publication (ECO-B2) basically has 9...b5 10. Nxc6 Bxc6 11. Qe3 as leading to an edge for White, and 9...h6 10. Bh4 Rc8 11. f4/9...Rc8 10. f4 h6 11. Bh4 as leading to equality. 

It doesn't mention 9...Be7, but addresses 9. f4 Be7 10. Be2, where among other things it cites the Fischer-Spassky game from '72.  As a bit of history you can see Robert Byrne's notes on p. 19 of the January 1973 Chess Life & Review.
http://uscf1-nyc1.aodhosting.com/CL-AND-CR-ALL/CL-ALL/1973/1973_01.pdf


In my old Beating the Sicilian book Nunn gave as a note that Blacks best was 9...h6 10. Bh4 Rc8, maybe that is why he later rejected the line. Still it needs attention.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #59 - 05/25/21 at 22:45:11
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Regarding this 9. Be2, one recent publication (ECO-B2) basically has 9...b5 10. Nxc6 Bxc6 11. Qe3 as leading to an edge for White, and 9...h6 10. Bh4 Rc8 11. f4/9...Rc8 10. f4 h6 11. Bh4 as leading to equality. 

It doesn't mention 9...Be7, but addresses 9. f4 Be7 10. Be2, where among other things it cites the Fischer-Spassky game from '72.  As a bit of history you can see Robert Byrne's notes on p. 19 of the January 1973 Chess Life & Review.
http://uscf1-nyc1.aodhosting.com/CL-AND-CR-ALL/CL-ALL/1973/1973_01.pdf
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #58 - 05/25/21 at 22:06:00
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1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 Nf6 5.Nc3 d6 6.Bg5
  1. BTS : Nunn (1984) Beating the Sicilian
  2. BTS2 : Nunn (1990) Beating the Sicilian II
  3. BTS3 : Nunn/Gallagher (1995) Beating the Sicilian III

In the "most solid" line 6...e6 7.Qd2 Be7 8.O-O-O O-O, Nunn consistently recommended 9.Nb3. In the line 6...e6 7.Qd2 a6 8.O-O-O Bd7, Nunn recommended 9.Be2 at first, but changed it later. In BTS2 he didn't say why the change, but in BTS he said:

Quote:
9.f4 is the usual move, but despite its lack of popularity 9.Be2 offers quite reasonable chances for white and has the advantage of setting a couple of really good traps.

6...e6 7.Qd2 a6 8.O-O-O Bd7

In the notes to Mnatsakanian - Banas, after 9.Be2 Be7 Nunn says "White may also try 10.f4" and this may indeed be a transposition to 9.f4 Be7 10.Be2...

I have no idea what current theory thinks of all this. I just hope we can all get on the same page about what line is being discussed.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #57 - 05/25/21 at 19:43:50
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LeeRoth wrote on 05/24/21 at 18:08:52:
It's a good course.  The coverage of the Rauzer is excellent and makes use of Shankland's own games.  I've gone through most of 6.Bg5 and 6.Bc4, checked the lines with an engine and database, and feel I could play these lines at a decent level.  I'd recommend it.  Given the topic and the abbreviated coverage of some sidelines, I'd guess its probably best suited for 1700 on up. 

Its worth noting, as well, that a lot of the early criticism is no longer valid.  The missing lines have been added, although tbh, they weren't that critical anyway.  The missing video was never actually missing, just misplaced by the Chessable team.  That too has been corrected.  And BTW, 9.Be2 is covered, albeit by transposition. 


I think the early criticisms are still very valid, because it is less about merely fixing the errors and omissions after the fact, and more about the frustrated consumers that had to report the issues in the first place. Beta Testers tasked with reviewing Courses for quality control need do a better job or then don't apply to do it. Moreover, what do you mean the missing video wasn't really missing? It had to be later added to the Course after I reported it missing, the details as to how it went missing or was misplaced is irrelevant to the consumer.

Simply fixing errors and omissions after the fact while commendable doesn't do much for the authors reputation nor does it inspire overall confidence in the quality of the work he produces. If you bought an appliance and you discovered it had missing screws, would you fully trust the product or brand because you were later provided with those screws. Just something to ponder.

I have to say businesses would probably consider you the dream customer. Easy to please, willing to tolerate sloppiness, not bothered much by attention to detail or lack thereof and offers damage control services free of charge. Smiley
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #56 - 05/25/21 at 18:32:15
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Keano wrote on 05/25/21 at 16:06:02:
LeeRoth wrote on 05/25/21 at 15:02:38:
9.Be2 Be7 10.f4 = 9.f4 Be7 10.Be2  Smiley




Thats not the same position at all, the Rauzer position is 6. Bg5 e6 7. Qd2 a6 8.O-O-O Bd7 9. Be2


@Keano

Very annoying when they don't pay attention to the details isn't it. He would make a good Chessable Beta-Tester.  Roll Eyes
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #55 - 05/25/21 at 16:06:02
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LeeRoth wrote on 05/25/21 at 15:02:38:
9.Be2 Be7 10.f4 = 9.f4 Be7 10.Be2  Smiley




Thats not the same position at all, the Rauzer position is 6. Bg5 e6 7. Qd2 a6 8.O-O-O Bd7 9. Be2
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #54 - 05/25/21 at 15:02:38
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Keano wrote on 05/25/21 at 09:19:50:
LeeRoth wrote on 05/24/21 at 18:08:52:
It's a good course.  The coverage of the Rauzer is excellent and makes use of Shankland's own games.  I've gone through most of 6.Bg5 and 6.Bc4, checked the lines with an engine and database, and feel I could play these lines at a decent level.  I'd recommend it.  Given the topic and the abbreviated coverage of some sidelines, I'd guess its probably best suited for 1700 on up. 

Its worth noting, as well, that a lot of the early criticism is no longer valid.  The missing lines have been added, although tbh, they weren't that critical anyway.  The missing video was never actually missing, just misplaced by the Chessable team.  That too has been corrected.  And BTW, 9.Be2 is covered, albeit by transposition. 

   


What transposition will result in that main-line Rauzer position?  Huh


9.Be2 Be7 10.f4 = 9.f4 Be7 10.Be2  Smiley





  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #53 - 05/25/21 at 09:19:50
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LeeRoth wrote on 05/24/21 at 18:08:52:
It's a good course.  The coverage of the Rauzer is excellent and makes use of Shankland's own games.  I've gone through most of 6.Bg5 and 6.Bc4, checked the lines with an engine and database, and feel I could play these lines at a decent level.  I'd recommend it.  Given the topic and the abbreviated coverage of some sidelines, I'd guess its probably best suited for 1700 on up. 

Its worth noting, as well, that a lot of the early criticism is no longer valid.  The missing lines have been added, although tbh, they weren't that critical anyway.  The missing video was never actually missing, just misplaced by the Chessable team.  That too has been corrected.  And BTW, 9.Be2 is covered, albeit by transposition. 

   


What transposition will result in that main-line Rauzer position?  Huh
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #52 - 05/24/21 at 18:08:52
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It's a good course.  The coverage of the Rauzer is excellent and makes use of Shankland's own games.  I've gone through most of 6.Bg5 and 6.Bc4, checked the lines with an engine and database, and feel I could play these lines at a decent level.  I'd recommend it.  Given the topic and the abbreviated coverage of some sidelines, I'd guess its probably best suited for 1700 on up. 

Its worth noting, as well, that a lot of the early criticism is no longer valid.  The missing lines have been added, although tbh, they weren't that critical anyway.  The missing video was never actually missing, just misplaced by the Chessable team.  That too has been corrected.  And BTW, 9.Be2 is covered, albeit by transposition. 

   



   
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #51 - 05/22/21 at 16:54:42
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NajdorfSlayer:

TopNotch wrote on 05/06/21 at 15:38:31:
So in summary I think if you are buying this course, then you will get decent coverage of 6 Bg5 ...

Topnotch:
That's pretty much all I was interested in anyway since as Sam says in the Intro, 6.Bg5 is the only challenging line to the Classical


The course may well be worth the money based the coverage of 6Bg5 alone. As I have not bought the course, I can not say for sure.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #50 - 05/22/21 at 14:27:10
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Given the feedback, I will give this one a pass.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #49 - 05/22/21 at 12:06:01
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TopNotch wrote on 05/21/21 at 14:40:16:
I hate the Move-Trainer but the material is the most up to date that there is out there. Also their best Opening Courses beat anything out there in print form hands down


As someone on this forum explained to me, one can click on the blue text and bypass the move trainer.

TopNotch wrote on 05/21/21 at 14:40:16:
Another high quality source is Modern-Chess.com, many titled players use their databases for tournament prep including GM's, at least that is what Boris Avrukh told me.


Avrukh has published 10 titles at Modern Chess.

The Modern Chess opening eBooks are up to date and often have a narrow focus. They also import well into ChessBase and Chess Opening Wizard. The Complete Rauzer Repertoire for Black (January 2019) by IM Ogulcan Kanmazalp is a must have for anyone who plays the Kozul (9...b5) variation.

I have maxed out on my free Short and Sweet Chessable eBooks. I will buy at some point. So far, I have to say that there is some good content, and it displays well on my computer screen. Is it all "in the cloud?" I am not aware of an option to download a title to my computer.

Our own beloved ChessPublishing has high quality content, displays well onscreen, and is up-to-date. The files download well to my computer. That is a major plus.

I have uploaded all past (CBV) files to ChessBase. All ECO B articles are available in one place. I can go through all Richter-Rauzer articles with 9...Be7, or 9...b5, sequentially. I did the same thing with PGN files and Chess Opening Wizard. So I can play out to any position of interest, and see the relevant ChessPublishing content. Either way, I can enter comments, or ask for engine analysis.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #48 - 05/21/21 at 14:40:16
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hicetnunc wrote on 05/21/21 at 09:49:10:
Chessable beta testing is performed by unpaid volunteers. So they test what they want. Some do a diligent work, some just don't care. Some are strong enough to spot holes or missing explanations but most of them are amateur 1200 players who don't even know the opening they're testing.

At the end of the day, Chessable sells these courses because their platform attracts a lot of users. I'm surprised to hear from many players nowadays that their first point of reference is a chessable course rather than a good old book  Smiley


I hate the Move-Trainer but the material is the most up to date that there is out there. Also their best Opening Courses beat anything out there in print form hands down.

Another high quality source is Modern-Chess.com, many titled players use their databases for tournament prep including GM's, at least that is what Boris Avrukh told me.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #47 - 05/21/21 at 09:49:10
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Chessable beta testing is performed by unpaid volunteers. So they test what they want. Some do a diligent work, some just don't care. Some are strong enough to spot holes or missing explanations but most of them are amateur 1200 players who don't even know the opening they're testing.

At the end of the day, Chessable sells these courses because their platform attracts a lot of users. I'm surprised to hear from many players nowadays that their first point of reference is a chessable course rather than a good old book  Smiley
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #46 - 05/21/21 at 09:33:00
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TopNotch wrote on 05/20/21 at 17:35:04:
No this line is not considered in the Course, and it's just more evidence that this product seemed rushed out before it was ready. Beta Testing was obviously very poor.


hmm, well its a very old recommendatiion, but still quite trappy so would have expected it to be covered. Was also tried out by Nigel Short I believe.

Maybe these modern guys just go with the latest fashion and forget the history
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #45 - 05/21/21 at 09:30:39
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doefmat wrote on 05/21/21 at 09:18:22:
What line exactly? Can you name the moves starting at move 7?


6. Bg5 e6 7. Qd2 a6 8.O-O-O Bd7 9. Be2
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #44 - 05/21/21 at 09:18:22
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Keano wrote on 05/20/21 at 06:52:55:
Does he cover the old John Nunn suggestion 9.Be2!? in the Rauzer?


What line exactly? Can you name the moves starting at move 7?

About the beta testing discussion; it isn't clear to me if Chessable uses proper editors or proofreaders. When reading introductions from ordinary paper opening books like ones from Quality Chess, writers usually mention people who have helped them. I believe it is very common that writers miss moves and other people at the publishing company help them before the book finally gets released. The final product is never made by just a single person.

We don't know if Chessable uses beta testers for this or not. Maybe they also have professionals to check the product before release and beta testing is only for grammar and other minor stuff.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #43 - 05/21/21 at 00:26:22
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TopNotch wrote on 05/20/21 at 17:35:04:
Keano wrote on 05/20/21 at 06:52:55:
Does he cover the old John Nunn suggestion 9.Be2!? in the Rauzer?


No this line is not considered in the Course, and it's just more evidence that this product seemed rushed out before it was ready. Beta Testing was obviously very poor.


Presumably, he meets 9.Be2 with 9..Be7 when White usually plays 10.f4.  That line is covered in the Course under the move order 9.f4 Be7 10.Be2. But, yes, if that was the intent, the transposition should have been noted.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #42 - 05/20/21 at 22:36:10
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That explains why I couldn't find out more about the beta testers -- I needed to create an account and login first. I agree with all the posts here, but I don't blame the beta testers. It's chessable's baby. I wouldn't sign up to be editor for a course without a hefty paycheck on offer, it's a serious time commitment if done right. And I would never, ever sign up to be an editor but with a job title of beta tester. I had a cheap employer try that game once, and after the third time they "rescheduled" our discussion about it I simply walked. So I would say chessable is getting what they deserve from the "beta testers". If the customers want better then they should put the onus squarely on chessable.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #41 - 05/20/21 at 22:00:25
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Dfan and Roley-Poley are absolutely correct. Beta-Testers are tasked to ensure the final product is the best quality it can be, that includes among other things catching missing lines.

How can you have a course entitled 'Lifetime Repertoire' when so much is missing and yes I blame the 'Beta Testers' who post all kinds of exaggerated and sometimes desperate sounding resumes to get the job but from performance are only interested in course access. I also blame any staff who re-hire these guys after sub par performances.

Obviously no course will be totally free of omissions and errors, nevertheless Chessable LTR's aren't cheap so the quality needs to match the price tag, which means rigorous quality control by qualified and committed Beta Testers.

Postscript: Beta Testing as it relates to Chessable Courses involves not just technical matters, on the contrary, a good working  knowledge of the subject matter is essential that is why each opening course has it's own ad specifying these requirements. Maybe Beta Tester in this sense is a misnomer as the Role embodies many editorial tasks.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #40 - 05/20/21 at 21:48:13
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Oh that's an interesting standard. I am not going anywhere near chessable then. Even calling it beta testing is a form of deceptive marketing, in my view, because it's not beta and it's not even alpha. I was told by a friend he makes more money from chessable than he does/did from books, and now I can understand why.

Two quotes from https://www.guru99.com/alpha-beta-testing-demystified.html, I put some text in bold.

Quote:
Alpha testing is carried out by the testers who are internal employees of the organization. The main goal is to identify the tasks that a typical user might perform and test them.


Quote:
Beta Testing is performed by "real users" of the software application in "real environment" and it can be considered as a form of external User Acceptance Testing. It is the final test before shipping a product to the customers.


Any programmer who routinely delivered software to alpha testing with "possibly" missing features, but "hey, let me know", I think would be hunting for a new job soon. As for a software company delivering a product that isn't even finished, never mind alpha or beta tested, I won't be using them ever. And I include Microsoft under Satya Nadella in this category. (I do use MS at work but it's not my decision and it's not my dime.) No software is completely free of bugs, but that's not an excuse for lowering the standards down to the cellar.

Let's carry this to an absurd conclusion. Former world champion Garry Kasparov "1.d4 according to G.K.", with exactly one move in the repertoire: 1.d4. Anything missing, let me know and I will update the course. Worth it?
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #39 - 05/20/21 at 20:10:03
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dfan wrote on 05/20/21 at 19:22:28:
an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 05/20/21 at 18:59:57:
There can be better beta testing and worse beta testing. But if a course has missing lines I don't understand how that has anything to do with beta testing. A beta tester should be making sure that links work, videos play, chapters are in order, simple stuff like that. The actual content should be up to the GM author, that's what they are getting paid for.

I am a software engineer, not a chess course author, but things like missing lines and unclear text are exactly the sort of things I would love for a beta tester to tell me about.


I was previously invited to beta test one of their courses a while back and the author specifically asked us to look out for unclear text and missing lines. I presumed that was expected from most if not all beta testers especially as most of them are much stronger than I and should therefore find it easier to spot gaps.

  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #38 - 05/20/21 at 19:22:28
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an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 05/20/21 at 18:59:57:
There can be better beta testing and worse beta testing. But if a course has missing lines I don't understand how that has anything to do with beta testing. A beta tester should be making sure that links work, videos play, chapters are in order, simple stuff like that. The actual content should be up to the GM author, that's what they are getting paid for.

I am a software engineer, not a chess course author, but things like missing lines and unclear text are exactly the sort of things I would love for a beta tester to tell me about.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #37 - 05/20/21 at 18:59:57
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TopNotch wrote on 05/20/21 at 17:35:04:
Beta Testing was obviously very poor.

There can be better beta testing and worse beta testing. But if a course has missing lines I don't understand how that has anything to do with beta testing. A beta tester should be making sure that links work, videos play, chapters are in order, simple stuff like that. The actual content should be up to the GM author, that's what they are getting paid for.

Maybe a chessable beta tester could chime in with what the expectations are. I searched on the chessable site and the only thing I saw was a requirement that they are not allowed to review courses. I couldn't even see a link for "Click here to become a beta tester".
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #36 - 05/20/21 at 17:35:04
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Keano wrote on 05/20/21 at 06:52:55:
Does he cover the old John Nunn suggestion 9.Be2!? in the Rauzer?


No this line is not considered in the Course, and it's just more evidence that this product seemed rushed out before it was ready. Beta Testing was obviously very poor.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #35 - 05/20/21 at 06:52:55
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Does he cover the old John Nunn suggestion 9.Be2!? in the Rauzer?
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #34 - 05/17/21 at 22:04:14
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doefmat wrote on 05/06/21 at 18:40:20:
Apparently, he also forget in the line 1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. Bb5+ Bd7 4. Bxd7+ Nxd7
5. O-O Ngf6 6. Qe2 e6 to cover the main move 7.b3. Only 7.c3 and 7.d4 are covered.


He has now covered this and added a few other lines that were missing.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #33 - 05/11/21 at 16:51:23
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No doubt you are right, but I can't be bothered to verify. It's just a blitz game. The only reason to watch someone else play blitz is if there's an odd number and I don't have a game myself.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #32 - 05/11/21 at 14:40:28
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FreeRepublic wrote on 05/11/21 at 12:42:46:
Did Shankland and his highly rated opponent repeatedly miss a skewer winning a rook in the video? After h5 White plays Rc8ch,  the black king moves, and Rxc3. If black then plays b2, threatening to queen, white plays Rb3 and nabs the pawn. Or if black plays Kb4 holding the pawn and attacking the rook, White can take the pawn, now or later, and still win the resulting pawn ending.

This can be found at 59:50 in the video. What am I missing?

Wow.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #31 - 05/11/21 at 12:42:46
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Paddy wrote on 05/04/21 at 00:00:15:
In Banter Blitz e.g.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3sDigCx7s4
Shankland


Did Shankland and his highly rated opponent repeatedly miss a skewer winning a rook in the video? After h5 White plays Rc8ch,  the black king moves, and Rxc3. If black then plays b2, threatening to queen, white plays Rb3 and nabs the pawn. Or if black plays Kb4 holding the pawn and attacking the rook, White can take the pawn, now or later, and still win the resulting pawn ending.

This can be found at 59:50 in the video. What am I missing?
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #30 - 05/09/21 at 15:54:02
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doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 16:13:08:
I'm truly sorry I made a typo and was too lazy to include the whole line. And I'm also sorry that I didn't apologize. I hope you guys can forgive me.


As you are so gracious, I forgive you. And the next time you post (an incorrect) move like "Khalifman's 8.Nxd5" I will immediately stop what I am doing and play detective so that I can help answer your question.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #29 - 05/08/21 at 12:30:03
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FreeRepublic wrote on 05/07/21 at 17:41:47:
najdorfslayer wrote on 05/06/21 at 05:57:04:
Also the 6 Bc4 Qb6 lines seem to be scantily brushed over.


Is 6...Qb6 his answer to 6Bc4 ?

I take it that his main line is:
1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Nc6 6. Bg5 e6 7. Qd2 a6 8. O-O-O Bd7 9. f4 Be7 Is that correct?

Does he provide any coverage of 9...b5?

From the little I've seen, I suspect that he has done good work on the equally important 9f3. If he can put that to bed, that is quite a benefit to those who play the Classical.


Yes he recommends 6...Qb6 but coverage it VERY light indeed. As is all his other 6th moves options other than 6 Bg5.

Yes he gives 9...Be7 and this is coveted quite well, but no 9...b5
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #28 - 05/07/21 at 18:17:20
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Curiously in Banter Blitz he has faced 9. f4 many times, but I don't recall anyone playing 9. f3.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #27 - 05/07/21 at 17:41:47
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najdorfslayer wrote on 05/06/21 at 05:57:04:
Also the 6 Bc4 Qb6 lines seem to be scantily brushed over.


Is 6...Qb6 his answer to 6Bc4 ?

I take it that his main line is:
1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Nc6 6. Bg5 e6 7. Qd2 a6 8. O-O-O Bd7 9. f4 Be7 Is that correct?

Does he provide any coverage of 9...b5?

From the little I've seen, I suspect that he has done good work on the equally important 9f3. If he can put that to bed, that is quite a benefit to those who play the Classical.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #26 - 05/07/21 at 16:28:22
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OK, this time I'll make an exception and accept your apologies. Make sure it won't happen again or I'll send Rutte and Hoekstra to sensibilisize you.






For those who are not familiar with recent Dutch politics:

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #25 - 05/07/21 at 16:13:08
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I'm truly sorry I made a typo and was too lazy to include the whole line. And I'm also sorry that I didn't apologize. I hope you guys can forgive me.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #24 - 05/07/21 at 15:45:21
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dali wrote on 05/07/21 at 14:18:08:
ah, someone else did. still, you can't typo a standalone move and expect people to know what you meant.


doormat didn't even apologise for the inconvenience of the misleading error, which could have been easily avoided by posting the preliminary moves to begin with. Hard to imagine posting a one move line, and still managing to get it wrong.

@doormat

Attention to detail is another reason I was able to spot some issues with Sam's course so quickly. It's my curse.

Postscript: I highlighted the text, partly because I figured there was a more than 50% chance it would be shown to be a careless mistake.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #23 - 05/07/21 at 14:18:08
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ah, someone else did. still, you can't typo a standalone move and expect people to know what you meant.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #22 - 05/07/21 at 13:58:45
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dali wrote on 05/07/21 at 13:05:29:
doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 12:11:15:
TopNotch wrote on 05/07/21 at 11:33:12:
doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 06:04:37:
In his past courses he checked all kind of other repertoire books but here there's no mention of Khalifman's 8.Nxd5 from 'Squeezing the Sicilian' in the Alapin mainline.
But maybe I'm nitpicking here


I presume you mean 8.Bxd5 which BTW is not Khalifman's recommendation in 'Squeezing the Sicilian'.



1.e4 c5 2.c3 Nf6 3.e5 Nd5 4.d4 cxd4 5.cxd4 d6 6.Nf3 Nc6 7.Bc4 dxe5 8.Nxe5

This is what Khalifman suggests, Shankland only covers dxe5

Only Khalifman has Nf3 before d4. Chapter 19


you literally highlight your own mistake and yet expect others to know what you meant?!


I didn't highlight anything.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #21 - 05/07/21 at 13:05:29
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doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 12:11:15:
TopNotch wrote on 05/07/21 at 11:33:12:
doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 06:04:37:
In his past courses he checked all kind of other repertoire books but here there's no mention of Khalifman's 8.Nxd5 from 'Squeezing the Sicilian' in the Alapin mainline.
But maybe I'm nitpicking here


I presume you mean 8.Bxd5 which BTW is not Khalifman's recommendation in 'Squeezing the Sicilian'.



1.e4 c5 2.c3 Nf6 3.e5 Nd5 4.d4 cxd4 5.cxd4 d6 6.Nf3 Nc6 7.Bc4 dxe5 8.Nxe5

This is what Khalifman suggests, Shankland only covers dxe5

Only Khalifman has Nf3 before d4. Chapter 19


you literally highlight your own mistake and yet expect others to know what you meant?!
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #20 - 05/07/21 at 12:30:17
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doefmat wrote on 05/04/21 at 21:39:59:
TopNotch wrote on 05/04/21 at 13:11:42:
This course seems to have been rushed out so that Sam can focus on his return to OTB chess. It's a lot less thorough than his other Chessable stuff and does not quite fit in with the Lifetime Repertoire ethos. Moreover the Beta Testers as is all too common do a sloppy job in picking up errors and omissions that should have been caught before this product hit the shelves so to speak.

Now within hours of the course release buyers have to wait on  reported missing video and missing lines to be eventually updated.  Very disappointing.


Isn't this judgement a bit premature? How can you look at this course thorough after one day of release?


Another review that echoes my sentiments, and judging by the reception I would say this will quickly emerge as the prevailing view:  https://www.chessable.com/discussion/thread/393645/review-disappointing/

Anyone that has Sam's other chessable courses can't help but notice that this effort was far below his usual standard.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #19 - 05/07/21 at 12:11:15
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TopNotch wrote on 05/07/21 at 11:33:12:
doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 06:04:37:
In his past courses he checked all kind of other repertoire books but here there's no mention of Khalifman's 8.Nxd5 from 'Squeezing the Sicilian' in the Alapin mainline.
But maybe I'm nitpicking here


I presume you mean 8.Bxd5 which BTW is not Khalifman's recommendation in 'Squeezing the Sicilian'.



1.e4 c5 2.c3 Nf6 3.e5 Nd5 4.d4 cxd4 5.cxd4 d6 6.Nf3 Nc6 7.Bc4 dxe5 8.Nxe5

This is what Khalifman suggests, Shankland only covers dxe5

Only Khalifman has Nf3 before d4. Chapter 19
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #18 - 05/07/21 at 11:33:12
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doefmat wrote on 05/07/21 at 06:04:37:
In his past courses he checked all kind of other repertoire books but here there's no mention of Khalifman's 8.Nxd5 from 'Squeezing the Sicilian' in the Alapin mainline.
But maybe I'm nitpicking here


I presume you mean 8.Bxd5 which BTW is not Khalifman's recommendation in 'Squeezing the Sicilian'.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #17 - 05/07/21 at 06:04:37
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In his past courses he checked all kind of other repertoire books but here there's no mention of Khalifman's 8.Nxd5 from 'Squeezing the Sicilian' in the Alapin mainline.
But maybe I'm nitpicking here
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #16 - 05/06/21 at 22:02:23
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Seems like he only cared about covering 6 Bg5 and the rest was an inconvenience for him to cover.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #15 - 05/06/21 at 18:40:20
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Apparently, he also forget in the line 1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. Bb5+ Bd7 4. Bxd7+ Nxd7
5. O-O Ngf6 6. Qe2 e6 to cover the main move 7.b3. Only 7.c3 and 7.d4 are covered.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #14 - 05/06/21 at 15:38:31
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najdorfslayer wrote on 05/06/21 at 05:57:04:
I bought this course and while parts are good, the 6 Bg5 e6 is covered quite well. Many lines are given a pathetically minimal coverage.

Like most top players they only really want to focus on 6 Bg5 and their rest is given hardly any coverage.

I do like that he gives 6...g6 against the 6 Be2, 6 f4 and 6 g3, as this is what I played before the course came out, but frankly I was astounded how little covered was given. One line on the 6 f4 (yes one line), 2 lines on 6 g3 and while 6 Be2 is given more coverage, its still woefully poor when you compare it to the thoroughness of the LTR on the Najdorf or the Taimanov.

If you wish to play 6...g6 in these lines, I would recommend getting Gawain Jones GM rep The Dragon Volume 2.

Also the 6 Bc4 Qb6 lines seem to be scantily brushed over.

I frankly wasn’t to interested in the Anti-Sicilian coverage as I have plenty of material on that already (LTR Najforf and GM rep Beating these Anti-Sicilians).

So in summary I think if you are buying this course, then you will get decent coverage of 6 Bg5, if you want to build a Classical Sicilian repertoire look elsewhere for their other move 6 responses.

Personally I wish I’d saved my money 2/5!


That's pretty much all I was interested in anyway since as Sam says in the Intro, 6.Bg5 is the only challenging line to the Classical. BTW it was interesting watching one of his Banter Blitzes when he faced The Smith Morra Gambit and ran into some unexpected problems when his opponent deviated slightly from his recommended line. Smiley

I said it before and I'd say again, this Course is best suited for Expert level players and above preferably with prior Sicilian experience.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #13 - 05/06/21 at 15:30:03
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najdorfslayer wrote on 05/06/21 at 05:57:04:
I do like that he gives 6...g6 against the 6 Be2, 6 f4 and 6 g3, as this is what I played before the course came out, but frankly I was astounded how little covered was given. One line on the 6 f4 (yes one line), 2 lines on 6 g3 and while 6 Be2 is given more coverage, its still woefully poor when you compare it to the thoroughness of the LTR on the Najdorf or the Taimanov.

By the way, in Banter Blitz he faced 6. Be2 g6 7. 0-0 Bg7 8. Be3 0-0 9. f4.  I was rather surprised to see him play 9...Bd7, instead of the ancient book move 9...Qb6.

  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #12 - 05/06/21 at 15:25:03
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doefmat wrote on 05/04/21 at 21:39:59:
TopNotch wrote on 05/04/21 at 13:11:42:
This course seems to have been rushed out so that Sam can focus on his return to OTB chess. It's a lot less thorough than his other Chessable stuff and does not quite fit in with the Lifetime Repertoire ethos. Moreover the Beta Testers as is all too common do a sloppy job in picking up errors and omissions that should have been caught before this product hit the shelves so to speak.

Now within hours of the course release buyers have to wait on  reported missing video and missing lines to be eventually updated.  Very disappointing.


Isn't this judgement a bit premature? How can you look at this course thorough after one day of release?


Not premature at all, no way a missing video should not have been caught, I caught it, also the entire course is a little under 11 hours when the average Lifetime Repertoire is closer to 20 hrs. The Anti-Sicilian coverage is more suited to master level players as he focuses on the key lines only, no fluff. One guy in the chessable forum was complaining that he was enjoying the Course but lamented that Sam forgot to cover 2. Bc4 and would like him to add some lines, a request which made me laugh hysterically.

How can you look at this course thorough after one day of release? Very easily, just skip the irrelevant stuff and head for the critical lines. Once I satisfy myself that all the crunch material has been covered I work backwards from there. Moreover Sam pretty much laid it out on the forum that now that OTB was returning he was very anxious to get back to his first love, and the product kind of reflects this even his disheveled unshaven appearance in the videos hints at this.

To be honest for the most part the Beta Testers on Chessable are just a joke, in it for free access to course material. Every Course that comes out within hours consumers find holes omissions and errors, and that should not be, I mean what are the Beta Testers their for.   
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #11 - 05/06/21 at 13:50:07
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #10 - 05/06/21 at 09:05:46
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doefmat wrote on 05/06/21 at 08:20:46:
You should post that review on Chessable  too imo.

My thoughts exactly! It can help improve the course if necessary, because the Chessable courses are always "work in progress", depending on the remarks of customers etc. I find that one of the pros of Chessable. You can make remarks and pose questions for everyone to see, including the author, so they can improve / update the course if needed.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #9 - 05/06/21 at 08:20:46
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You should post that review on Chessable  too imo.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #8 - 05/06/21 at 05:57:04
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I bought this course and while parts are good, the 6 Bg5 e6 is covered quite well. Many lines are given a pathetically minimal coverage.

Like most top players they only really want to focus on 6 Bg5 and their rest is given hardly any coverage.

I do like that he gives 6...g6 against the 6 Be2, 6 f4 and 6 g3, as this is what I played before the course came out, but frankly I was astounded how little covered was given. One line on the 6 f4 (yes one line), 2 lines on 6 g3 and while 6 Be2 is given more coverage, its still woefully poor when you compare it to the thoroughness of the LTR on the Najdorf or the Taimanov.

If you wish to play 6...g6 in these lines, I would recommend getting Gawain Jones GM rep The Dragon Volume 2.

Also the 6 Bc4 Qb6 lines seem to be scantily brushed over.

I frankly wasn’t to interested in the Anti-Sicilian coverage as I have plenty of material on that already (LTR Najforf and GM rep Beating these Anti-Sicilians).

So in summary I think if you are buying this course, then you will get decent coverage of 6 Bg5, if you want to build a Classical Sicilian repertoire look elsewhere for their other move 6 responses.

Personally I wish I’d saved my money 2/5!
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #7 - 05/04/21 at 21:39:59
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TopNotch wrote on 05/04/21 at 13:11:42:
This course seems to have been rushed out so that Sam can focus on his return to OTB chess. It's a lot less thorough than his other Chessable stuff and does not quite fit in with the Lifetime Repertoire ethos. Moreover the Beta Testers as is all too common do a sloppy job in picking up errors and omissions that should have been caught before this product hit the shelves so to speak.

Now within hours of the course release buyers have to wait on  reported missing video and missing lines to be eventually updated.  Very disappointing.


Isn't this judgement a bit premature? How can you look at this course thorough after one day of release?
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #6 - 05/04/21 at 13:11:42
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This course seems to have been rushed out so that Sam can focus on his return to OTB chess. It's a lot less thorough than his other Chessable stuff and does not quite fit in with the Lifetime Repertoire ethos. Moreover the Beta Testers as is all too common do a sloppy job in picking up errors and omissions that should have been caught before this product hit the shelves so to speak.

Now within hours of the course release buyers have to wait on  reported missing video and missing lines to be eventually updated.  Very disappointing.
  

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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #5 - 05/04/21 at 08:30:11
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Paddy wrote on 05/04/21 at 00:00:15:
Shankland didn't play the Kozul, instead opting for the older line 6 Bg5 e6 7 Qd2 a6 8 0-0-0 Bd7 9 f4 Be7 (which incidentally was Spassky's choice against Fischer in their 1972 match). This line has always had some supporters but started appearing again at high level around 2017, with some new ideas regarding how to organise counterplay for Black in the main line with 10 Nf3 b5 11 Bxf6 gxf6.

So it would reasonable to hazard a guess that this "Spassky line" is Shankland's choice for his Chessable repertoire.


Yes, this is the line he gives. I'm very pleased that this repertoire has been published, as I used to play the Classical years ago (on the rare occasions when an opponent would play 2.Nf3 and 3.d4...) and I'd like to go back to it.
  
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Pantu
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #4 - 05/04/21 at 08:27:21
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It's one of the profoundly irritating features of Chessable that they prefer to write a bunch of meaningless Lakdawala-esque waffle in the introduction rather than a quick overview of the repertoire.

I fail to see how adding something like the following (assuming this is the repertoire):

6.f3 e5
6.Be2 e5
6.Bc4 e6 7.Be3 e6 8.Bb3 Be7
6.Bg5 e6 7.Qd2 a6 8.0-0-0 Bd7 9.f3 Nxd4
6.Bg5 e6 7.Qd2 a6 8.0-0-0 Bd7 9.f4 Be7

has impact, since this gets revealed eventually by the "Short & Sweet" version. Presumably someone smarter than me has decided this heightens interest or something.
  
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Paddy
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #3 - 05/04/21 at 00:00:15
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FreeRepublic wrote on 05/03/21 at 18:58:37:
https://www.chessable.com/lifetime-repertoires-classical-sicilian/course/68589/

I haven't gone through the sample video yet. However I did a search of Chess Assistant for Shankland, as black, and B60-B69. He's played for the Kozul, but his opponents played 9f3 instead of 9f4. His 2020 results were +3,0,-1 against topflight opponents!


In Banter Blitz e.g.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3sDigCx7s4
Shankland didn't play the Kozul, instead opting for the older line 6 Bg5 e6 7 Qd2 a6 8 0-0-0 Bd7 9 f4 Be7 (which incidentally was Spassky's choice against Fischer in their 1972 match). This line has always had some supporters but started appearing again at high level around 2017, with some new ideas regarding how to organise counterplay for Black in the main line with 10 Nf3 b5 11 Bxf6 gxf6.

So it would reasonable to hazard a guess that this "Spassky line" is Shankland's choice for his Chessable repertoire.
  
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kylemeister
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #2 - 05/03/21 at 20:40:02
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It might be of interest that Shankland has been playing the Classical (when given the opportunity) in Banter Blitz, and his next scheduled session (this Thursday) is specifically vs. 1. e4.
  
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Re: Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
Reply #1 - 05/03/21 at 18:59:46
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Clarification, he won three and lost one.
  
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FreeRepublic
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Shankland Chessable course on the Classical Sicili
05/03/21 at 18:58:37
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https://www.chessable.com/lifetime-repertoires-classical-sicilian/course/68589/

I haven't gone through the sample video yet. However I did a search of Chess Assistant for Shankland, as black, and B60-B69. He's played for the Kozul, but his opponents played 9f3 instead of 9f4. His 2020 results were +3,0,-1 against topflight opponents!
  
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