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Normal Topic Evan's gambit in 2023 (Read 915 times)
Dink Heckler
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Re: Evan's gambit in 2023
Reply #5 - 12/18/23 at 12:10:28
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Ha, same! 'Looks OK to me...ummm, hold on; White's a pawn down for nothing'
  

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MartinC
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Re: Evan's gambit in 2023
Reply #4 - 12/18/23 at 09:16:53
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That was certainly my first reaction to those 'almost Spanish' positions - black seems to have a coherent set up, white's Q on b2 is somewhat weird - and.... white has somehow misplaced his b pawn.
  
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FreeRepublic
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Re: Evan's gambit in 2023
Reply #3 - 12/18/23 at 01:43:45
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If you like Chessable you might like Krykun's course:

https://www.chessable.com/the-dynamic-italian-game/course/42964/

He also provides a short and sweet version, free, but less extensive:

https://www.chessable.com/short-sweet-krykuns-italian-game/course/50526/
  
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Sinn
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Re: Evan's gambit in 2023
Reply #2 - 12/18/23 at 00:52:49
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Yes, this is what happens in my first 2 examples. With the -0.5.

THe more I look at them the more I realize white is down a pawn for nothing in those "spanish type" position.

Feels like an archangel with 1 pawn less:

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I think trying to play for a win in those kind of positions is the responsible thing to do:

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FreeRepublic
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Re: Evan's gambit in 2023
Reply #1 - 12/18/23 at 00:15:50
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Sinn wrote on 12/17/23 at 18:21:08:
I'm tired of playing boring chess in response to e5 and I'm completely ok with 0.00 advantage according to the computer since this doesn't take into account dynamic possibility, preparation, experience etc...


I agree.

Sometimes analysts will say something like "with compensation for the sacrificed material." I don't think many players would be discouraged to have compensation for the sacrificed material. In terms of computer evaluation, this might show as 0.00. Likewise, I see no reason to object to getting such a position.

It's been awhile since I looked at the Evans Gambit. My recollection is that with best play, it may be White who has to play accurately to reach equality. However, in practice White often wins.

Another way of putting it is that Black must play accurately to stay in the game. If he does so, then it's White's turn to demonstrate accuracy.
  
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Sinn
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Evan's gambit in 2023
12/17/23 at 18:21:08
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I'm tired of playing boring chess in response to e5 and I'm completely ok with 0.00 advantage according to the computer since this doesn't take into account dynamic possibility, preparation, experience etc...

I remember that 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5!? is very weird, dynamic and lively all around and when I analyzed it I couldn't find any way for black to avoid complications (white even has multiple equally complex attempts).

In the same veins most line of the evans gambit are tricky and very complex. Even the declined version look like a good italian with a comfortable advantage.

But as most serious player of the evans gambit would know the real problem comes with the bronstein defense:
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Bxb4 5. c3 Ba5 6. d4 d6

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It's completely ok and you have a draw no matter your attempt. Black can't play for a win (this isn't the king's gambit lol).

But I would really like to play it OTB against good opposition!
So I don't want to have any forced draw even if they're quite complex to find.

Anyway here's my finding so far. With stockfish 16 as backpup. If you've worked on it feel free to step in.

I first worked on this line:

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Bxb4 5. c3 Ba5 6. d4 d6 7. Qb3 Qd7 8. O-O Bb6 9. Bb5

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After a few move: 9.  ...a6 10. Ba4 Ba7 11. Qb2 b5 12. Bc2 Rb8

you end up here:

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Something about this position felt nice but I couldn't make it work. Forced draw everywhere and if you avoid all of them you end up in position like this at -0.5 according to the engine:

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Feels like a tabiya but I don't know how to assess it.

You can also choose to end up here:

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The other options is to accept the exchange of the bishop with Na5 (instead of going Bb5 and playing a spanish with a pawn less):

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Bxb4 5. c3 Ba5 6. d4 d6 7. Qb3 Qd7 8. O-O Bb6 9. Nbd2 Na5

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This variation has less tension and the question is less "is it playable despite what the computer say?" and more "Is there any play left?".

The two place you will end up if you play the theory dynamically are:

1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Bxb4 5. c3 Ba5 6. d4 d6 7. Qb3 Qd7 8. O-O Bb6 9. Nbd2 Na5 10. Qc2 Nxc4 11. Nxc4 Qc6 12. Nxb6 axb6 13. dxe5 dxe5 14. Nxe5 Qa4

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Opposite color bishop in a middlegame --> help the attacker. If you manage to play Bb2, c4 and put your rook on g3 this becomes very interesting: this is this guy recomandation: https://youtu.be/ZGs29B-6Fg4?si=6OSRAS_pN0iMcJzN&t=1370

for example:

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or

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but this grandmaster disagree lol : https://youtu.be/Ynb0_o-eC6o?si=EvKhTmtKrdJYmiex&t=1144
Problem the line this grandmaster propose instead isn't worth mentioning it's refuted by ...f5!! by black and black take the initiative.

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The first guy do not discuss this other line:

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where black doesn't take on c4 and you have nothing better to do than take on e5 and d6. It's not clear that the position is advantegeous here. Or that there is any play left.



  
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