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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match (Read 10925 times)
ArKheiN
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #53 - 07/26/05 at 22:51:11
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Lots of luck in chess, by the way, if your goal as White is "about equality." 


Well, Iam not a god to say that this is full equality here without having played a complete game after theses moves. It's for that I think it is equality without being 100% sure because Iam just an human thinking about a position without ever having played it. If I have played that move, I would know if it is complete equality or not.
But please don't play too much with words too. Oh and you have not to precise which of your rook will be on f8, only the h8 rook can go here Wink
  
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #52 - 07/26/05 at 20:32:18
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No problem, I understand, take the time you want to think about your next move. 

And about 15.Rdf1, I agree that ..e5 could be the best reply like I said in my previous post. After 15.Rdf1 e5 16.Bc4 Nf4 I would play 17. Bxf4 exf4 18.Re1 0-0-0 19.c3 Nb6 20.Nc5 and you are still a pawn up but I have enough activity to have about equality.


"About equality!"  I won that game already, against a strong opponent, and I would be happy to play a further game with 15. Rdf1, if anyone would care to take White's side of it.  But there is no time limit here, so perhaps further games had better be played on www.net-chess.com, where my handle is "cornstalk".  I will take all comers who propose the BDG, and I will both provide links and report results here.

Lots of luck in chess, by the way, if your goal as White is "about equality."

My move:

1.d4 d5  2. e4 dxe4  3. Nc3 Nf6  4. f3 exf3  5. Nxf3 Bf5  6. Ne5 e6 7.g4 Bg6 8.Qf3 c6  9. g5 Nh5 10.Be3 Nd7 11.Nxg6 hxg6 12.Bd3 Bd6 13.Ne4 Bc7  14. O-O-O Qe7 15.Rhf1 Rhf8

The gods of chess said, "Play solid moves; eschew the second pawn."
  

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ArKheiN
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #51 - 07/26/05 at 14:07:23
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P.S.  ArKheiN, in CC, your "clock" runs while your opponent is on leave.  That is why, I suppose, I expected you to produce a move sooner than this.  Since you are now taking 10 days to produce your moves, I assume you will not complain if I do so, too.


No problem, I understand, take the time you want to think about your next move. 

And about 15.Rdf1, I agree that ..e5 could be the best reply like I said in my previous post. After 15.Rdf1 e5 16.Bc4 Nf4 I would play 17. Bxf4 exf4 18.Re1 0-0-0 19.c3 Nb6 20.Nc5 and you are still a pawn up but I have enough activity to have about equality. It is sufficient in long-term is another question, that would have been a debate if I had choosed 15.Rdf1. My move : Rhf1!? is even harder to evaluate but I see some dangers in the a3-f8 diagonal/f-file for Black that will give me counterplay for my 1-2 pawn down. There is equaly somes idea on c4-d5 for White. I think this position is just equal at the moment.
  
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #50 - 07/26/05 at 10:02:36
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Against openings like the BDG, I think a good strategy is to play solidly (not passively, but not too forcefully either), in order to give White the chance to overpress in order to maintain an active position.


The real point is not that one hopes White will overpress (though it's nice if he does), but simply that one awaits whatever specifics emerge from White's play, and reacts as well as possible.  Once White gambits his pawn, he does not necessarily need to overpress to obtain a difficult game.
  

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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #49 - 07/26/05 at 08:37:58
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Just a few observations on opening philosophy against risky gambits (that may not necessarily apply to this particular situation).

In Bonsai's game against Sevenviolets, he chose very direct and forceful play to force at least equality.  In my eyes, the problem with this strategy is that in order to nullify your opponents chances in such a forceful way, you also nullify you own chances to an extent.  This reminds me of a comment of Korchnoi to a strong younger player after he drew against opponent with an inferior position.  I think it went something like:  "Why did you play so forcefully?  You could have given him chances to make his own mistakes."

Against openings like the BDG, I think a good strategy is to play solidly (not passively, but not too forcefully either), in order to give White the chance to overpress in order to maintain an active position.  I think in such situations, this also gives Black a psychological edge.  I think Markovich's approach follows this characterization of solid play against a gambit.  I think this approach is very practical in an over the board situation (in longer time controls, not necessarily blitz).


Leaving aside the question of my play in this game, I fully agree with the broad ideas that you express here.  Take the pawn and then defend soundly, shifting your pieces around and looking for ways to simplify the position.

ArKheiN plays a principled but rather risky move.   Now taking the h-pawn will pretty well ensure a won ending, if only I can reach one; White will have to stake everything on some sort of attack.  But Black's ending is probably won even without taking the h-pawn, and spending a tempo simply to win a second pawn is not always the best way to defend this kind of position.  No, the best reason for taking the pawn is to conquer g6, thus contributing activity to my bishop and my rim-knight.  White will perhaps use his extra tempo to strengthen his battery on the f-file or create one on the g1-a7 diagonal (which he would eventually like to open with d4-d5).   

Although I am not terribly impressed by White's activity even then (I can see only one plan, which is c2-c4, d4-d5), I will have to commune with the gods of chess for awhile to see what they would like me to do.   

In an earlier CC game, I faced 15. Rdf1 and did indeed play 15...e5!, which immediately activated my rim-knight.  I haven't been able to find the full score of that game, but as I recall, it went 16. Bc4 Nf4 and Black was fine.  Indeed, I think Black is =+ after 15...e5.

If White wants his d-rook on f1 while avoiding this possibility, he could also have tried 13. 0-0-0 and if 13...Qe7, then 14. Rdf1, after which 14...e5? allows 15. d5.  Of course, Black might consider 13...Qc7 instead of 13...Qe7.

P.S.  ArKheiN, in CC, your "clock" runs while your opponent is on leave.  That is why, I suppose, I expected you to produce a move sooner than this.  Since you are now taking 10 days to produce your moves, I assume you will not complain if I do so, too.
« Last Edit: 07/26/05 at 09:49:22 by Markovich »  

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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #48 - 07/25/05 at 21:01:56
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Just a few observations on opening philosophy against risky gambits (that may not necessarily apply to this particular situation).

In Bonsai's game against Sevenviolets, he chose very direct and forceful play to force at least equality.  In my eyes, the problem with this strategy is that in order to nullify your opponents chances in such a forceful way, you also nullify you own chances to an extent.  This reminds me of a comment of Korchnoi to a strong younger player after he drew against opponent with an inferior position.  I think it went something like:  "Why did you play so forcefully?  You could have given him chances to make his own mistakes."

Against openings like the BDG, I think a good strategy is to play solidly (not passively, but not too forcefully either), in order to give White the chance to overpress in order to maintain an active position.  I think in such situations, this also gives Black a psychological edge.  I think Markovich's approach follows this characterization of solid play against a gambit.  I think this approach is very practical in an over the board situation (in longer time controls, not necessarily blitz).
  

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ArKheiN
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #47 - 07/25/05 at 13:28:05
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Ok Markovich, I waited until your return to think a bit more about my next move and to post it for your return of vacation. 1.d4 d5  2. e4 dxe4  3. Nc3 Nf6  4. f3 exf3  5. Nxf3 Bf5  6. Ne5 e6 7.g4 Bg6 8.Qf3 c6  9. g5 Nh5 10.Be3 Nd7 11.Nxg6 hxg6 12.Bd3 Bd6 13.Ne4 Bc7  14. O-O-O Qe7 15.Rhf1!?


Iam still not sure which of the "solid" Rdf1 and the interesting, sharper but more risky 15.Rhf1 is the best. Rdf1 let the h2 pawn protected but the 2 rooks are less active than on d1-f1 , and the Rhf1 let the h2 pawn en-prise but White begins to be dynamic and I have prepared somes poisons moves depending or your response. But what I think is that both 15.Rhf1 and Rdf1 gives equality to White. I think that 15.Rdf1 e5!? would have been a good way to activate Black position that doesnt seems so good against 15.Rhf1, it was one of the reason of my choice and in the spirit of the opening, White have to take somes risks to win.

  
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #46 - 07/16/05 at 11:12:51
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I'll be away on a little trip.  Back 7-26.  Best to all.
  

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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #45 - 07/13/05 at 10:52:01
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It was hard to choose the best "move order"I was hesitating with 13.0-0-0 or even 13.Rf1 but Ne4 would be played for sure sooner or later, and I can now play c4 if needed.
  
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #44 - 07/13/05 at 10:24:04
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1.d4 d5  2. e4 dxe4  3. Nc3 Nf6  4. f3 exf3  5. Nxf3 Bf5  6. Ne5 e6 7.g4 Bg6 8.Qf3 c6  9. g5 Nh5 10.Be3 Nd7 11.Nxg6 hxg6 12.Bd3 Bd6 13.Ne4 Bc7  14. O-O-O Qe7

It may be a quibble, but I think that 13. O-O-O would've been more precise.  To me, it isn't obvious that the knight should go immediately to e4.

The kibitzers have been curiously silent concerning the technical points of this game.
  

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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #43 - 07/13/05 at 08:55:26
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1.d4 d5  2. e4 dxe4  3. Nc3 Nf6  4. f3 exf3  5. Nxf3 Bf5  6. Ne5 e6 7.g4 Bg6 8.Qf3 c6  9. g5 Nh5 10.Be3 Nd7 11.Nxg6 hxg6 12.Bd3 Bd6 13.Ne4

And if 13..Bc7 then 14.0-0-0
  
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #42 - 07/11/05 at 18:01:55
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Not at the moment, I'll be going on a vacation soonish (at least by the standards of correspondence chess) and there's little point in taking up a game at the moment. But thanks for being willing to trust one of your positions to me Smiley.


Actually, I myself will be going on a little trip starting July 16, this coming Saturday.  I'll be gone for a several days.  I would expect to be able to post again by Tuesday, July 26.  So I guess that's nine days off.
  

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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #41 - 07/11/05 at 16:10:38
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If you have not found a taker for the Black side of 10. Nxg6 hxg6  11. Bd3, I will be happy to take up your challenge after this game.  However I do urge Bonsai to do so immediately, so perhaps I will be able to take on Patrik and his 8. Bg2.

Not at the moment, I'll be going on a vacation soonish (at least by the standards of correspondence chess) and there's little point in taking up a game at the moment. But thanks for being willing to trust one of your positions to me Smiley.
  
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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #40 - 07/11/05 at 14:28:59
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If you have not found a taker for the Black side of 10. Nxg6 hxg6  11. Bd3, I will be happy to take up your challenge after this game.  However I do urge Bonsai to do so immediately, so perhaps I will be able to take on Patrik and his 8. Bg2.

1.d4 d5  2. e4 dxe4  3. Nc3 Nf6  4. f3 exf3  5. Nxf3 Bf5  6. Ne5 e6 7.g4 Bg6 8.Qf3 c6  9. g5 Nh5 10.Be3 Nd7 11.Nxg6 hxg6 12.Bd3 Bd6


My move here is pretty easy.  I want to be able to play ...Qe7, defending my f-pawn, as soon as White plays a rook to f1.  Since he can do that right away, I need to take this opportunity to develop my remaining bishop.  If White plays his knight to e4, my bishop will have a nice square on c7.   

I also spent some time looking at 12. O-O-O and 12. Be2.  The latter particularly seems to have some point.  Against the former, which entirely preserves White's options with his f1 bishop, I was considering 12...Qa5 with the possibility of ...Qf5 soon, or ...Bb4 in some cases.

For the time being, I maintain my view that Black is better.    

  

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Re: ArKheiN - Markovich, 2005, BDG Challenge Match
Reply #39 - 07/11/05 at 13:08:26
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I really wanted to play 10.Nxg6 hxg6 11.Bd3 because I spent hours analysing it to know if it was about playable. So, I hope that you will play this line as Black after our actual game. 

1.d4 d5  2. e4 dxe4  3. Nc3 Nf6  4. f3 exf3  5. Nxf3 Bf5  6. Ne5 e6 7.g4 Bg6 8.Qf3 c6  9. g5 Nh5 10.Be3 Nd7 11.Nxg6 hxg6 12.Bd3
  
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