Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 
Topic Tools
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) The Snyder variation (Read 23036 times)
lost highway
Senior Member
****
Offline


I may be crazy.

Posts: 471
Joined: 06/17/05
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #11 - 10/02/05 at 11:15:38
Post Tools
You could ask Lev D. Zilbermints (remember him?) who has probably already named this after himself.

- Lost Highway
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Glenn Snow
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1720
Location: Franklin
Joined: 09/27/03
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #10 - 10/02/05 at 10:50:42
Post Tools
I too really like the addition of Stefan Bücker to the Chesscafe writing staff.  Wether you agree or disagree with his views he always interesting and usually original.

I don't really like the idea of naming 1.e4 c5 2.b3 the Short variation.  Just because he's a very strong grandmaster who played it a few times doesn't seem like a very good reason to name it after him.  I guess this goes back to my proposed topic of "what criteria should be used to name opening variations?".  I would rather see the name go to whoever developed the variation the most and used it quite often in actual practice.  Of course a chess opening doesn't have to always be named after a chess player but I think there should be some really compelling reasons for doing so.  For instance due to it's frequent discussion on this forum I propose that 2.b3 be called "the chesspublishing.com forum variation".  (jk)
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TalJechin
God Member
*****
Offline


There is no secret ingredient.

Posts: 2892
Location: Malmö
Joined: 08/12/04
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #9 - 10/02/05 at 03:46:38
Post Tools
Quote:


Ok, without going too deeply into the philosophy, sociology, and literary criticism of it all, giving 2.b3 the name of Robert Snyder just seems wrong.   

As someone else pointed out, Czerniak made a study of the line, and it's been known for decades before Snyder played and taught it. His main claim to the name is that he has encouraged some of his students to play it.  The only reason he may get away with it is that 2.b3 is so obscure that nobody will really challenge it.  Let's challenge it. 

Let's change the name of this thread to either "1.e4 c5 2.b3" or the "Czerniak Variation of the Closed Sicilian".  ChessPub has a fair amount of influence on opening names, as certain people in the BDG threads have discovered.  Let's use that influence for good causes!


Well, Snyder did write the first book 'The Snyder Sicilian' (or rather pamphlet as it wasn't very thick) on 2.b3 in the late 1970s. 

But names tend to change as new players take over, and the last decade the main proponent is GM Tamaz Gelashvili who seems to be playing it whenever he gets the chance... 

So imo The Gelashvili Variation would be well earned, just look at the links below!

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessplayer?pid=49264

http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1170580

The problem is not really Snyder's name on the variation (though I can't say I like it as it means something in danish...) but rather the english language and culture dominating the world and pushing the names of English and American players. 

So, in the future I suppose 2.b3 might become 'the Short variation' instead, as Nigel has played it a handful of times against players he should beat anyway, ratingwise... 

An example of this would be e.g. Andrew Martin's articles on 2.b3 at chessville, focusing on a game by Short and with some other english players mentioned in the side notes - neither Gelashvili or Czerniak are mentioned... 

http://www.chessville.com/instruction/Openings/Martin/Index.htm

The articles are quite nice and instructive for those who wish to try out 2.b3, and I don't think Martin deliberately tried to diminish the influence of Gelashvili or Czerniak or anyone else. It's quite understandable that when taking a quick look at an interesting system, you tend to notice the names of people you know or have met, or at least you know their approximate playing strength, or stories about them etc etc... 

Had these articles been written by e.g. a russian GM, quite different names would surely have been featured... 

The problem is more that almost everybody understands english nowadays but the majority of chess articles at the big sites and magazines & books etc are written by native speakers, who naturally will be writing for an audience of native speakers while the real audience is chess players in the whole world... 

- But of course, it wouldn't hurt if writers were aware of this cultural bias when writing. One recent nice thing in this respect is that Chesscafe.com has recruited Stefan Bücker for a monthly article. At least it's a step in the right direction...
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TopNotch
God Member
*****
Offline


I only look 1 move ahead,
but its always the best

Posts: 2211
Joined: 01/04/03
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #8 - 10/02/05 at 02:01:18
Post Tools
Quote:
Glenn, 

IM Semkov just recently said it doesn't matter what name an opening has, and it changes all the time.  I have a linguistic bent, and like the power of being able to call something "Fred", "George" The Hundred Years' War" or whatever.  Ok, so George may be a girl, and the The Brits can't count.  

But giving things a name shows that we have some control over them.  We need to find appropriate names, and give credit where due whenever possible, but naming things is part of our humanity.  It's part of our ability to organise our lives in the chaos of reality.

Ok, without going too deeply into the philosophy, sociology, and literary criticism of it all, giving 2.b3 the name of Robert Snyder just seems wrong.  

As someone else pointed out, Czerniak made a study of the line, and it's been known for decades before Snyder played and taught it. His main claim to the name is that he has encouraged some of his students to play it.  The only reason he may get away with it is that 2.b3 is so obscure that nobody will really challenge it.  Let's challenge it. 

Let's change the name of this thread to either "1.e4 c5 2.b3" or the "Czerniak Variation of the Closed Sicilian".  ChessPub has a fair amount of influence on opening names, as certain people in the BDG threads have discovered.  Let's use that influence for good causes!


*Sigh*

Toppy Grin
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
God Member
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #7 - 10/02/05 at 01:47:05
Post Tools
Glenn, 

IM Semkov just recently said it doesn't matter what name an opening has, and it changes all the time.  I have a linguistic bent, and like the power of being able to call something "Fred", "George" The Hundred Years' War" or whatever.  Ok, so George may be a girl, and the The Brits can't count.   

But giving things a name shows that we have some control over them.  We need to find appropriate names, and give credit where due whenever possible, but naming things is part of our humanity.  It's part of our ability to organise our lives in the chaos of reality.

Ok, without going too deeply into the philosophy, sociology, and literary criticism of it all, giving 2.b3 the name of Robert Snyder just seems wrong.   

As someone else pointed out, Czerniak made a study of the line, and it's been known for decades before Snyder played and taught it. His main claim to the name is that he has encouraged some of his students to play it.  The only reason he may get away with it is that 2.b3 is so obscure that nobody will really challenge it.  Let's challenge it. 

Let's change the name of this thread to either "1.e4 c5 2.b3" or the "Czerniak Variation of the Closed Sicilian".  ChessPub has a fair amount of influence on opening names, as certain people in the BDG threads have discovered.  Let's use that influence for good causes!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Glenn Snow
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1720
Location: Franklin
Joined: 09/27/03
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #6 - 10/01/05 at 22:19:39
Post Tools
This would possibly make a good topic itself.  What criteria should be used when naming opening variations? I'm not quite sure I have the energy right now for such a discussion but others may.  (Albatross! -- thought I'd add that before someone else did.)
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
lost highway
Senior Member
****
Offline


I may be crazy.

Posts: 471
Joined: 06/17/05
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #5 - 10/01/05 at 10:05:56
Post Tools
Quote:
Yes, people should do a little historical research before the start slapping on their own names or any other made up name.  Robert Snyder has contributed to the development of the variation but it doesn't surprise me that probably someone else's name should be used for 2.b3.

Someone could call it the Larsen Opening Deferred (1.b3 c5 2.e4)  Grin

- Lost Highway
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Glenn Snow
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1720
Location: Franklin
Joined: 09/27/03
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #4 - 09/27/05 at 23:38:17
Post Tools
Yes, people should do a little historical research before they start slapping on their own names or any other made up name.  Robert Snyder has contributed to the development of the variation but it doesn't surprise me that probably someone else's name should be used for 2.b3.
« Last Edit: 10/01/05 at 22:17:15 by Glenn Snow »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
basqueknight
Ex Member


Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #3 - 09/27/05 at 21:43:28
Post Tools
I only went with what martin wrote! sorry for the offense.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10780
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #2 - 09/27/05 at 21:36:45
Post Tools
Snyder Variation?
Moshe Czerniak has played 2.b3 since 1943: so Czerniak Variation is more appropriate.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Glenn Snow
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1720
Location: Franklin
Joined: 09/27/03
Gender: Male
Re: The Snyder variation
Reply #1 - 09/25/05 at 23:44:56
Post Tools
You should check out these other threads:
http://altmax.com/cgi-local/cpf/YaBB.cgi?board=AntiSicilians;action=display;num=...

http://altmax.com/cgi-local/cpf/YaBB.cgi?board=AntiSicilians;action=display;num=...

This last thread mentions other related threads (one of which may or may not be the first thread here) in one of the posts (by me incidentally).  Perfectly clear, right?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
basqueknight
Ex Member


The Snyder variation
09/25/05 at 23:14:06
Post Tools
I am always searching for ways to take black out of book or at least in to the unknown of there book. So i was looking at an article by Andrew Martin called NOSHER ON ICE

It starts off with 1.e4 c5 2.b3!?

It goes on to sight a game Short,N-Prasad,D ch-commonwelth Mubai IND 14-01-2004

it was very interesting and i was wondering what every one thought of this opening choice. I think i might try it at the club this week.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo