Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Center-Counter/Scandinavian (Read 10690 times)
gjempty
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #13 - 09/22/03 at 00:31:56
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Thank you, gjempty, for offering the advice of playing as black; any and all advice is appreciated.
However, could you please try to address and/or attack the subject without attacking the individual? If you would care to re-read both this thread and the Patzer variation thread you might then reallize that I indeed did NOT make contradicting statements! I have not ran into the Scandinavian a great deal! In fact, I have only faced ONE opponent who uses it against me; and he has used it against me NUMEROUS times! And to boot, the exact 8 move order has indeed been repeated NUMEROUS times!-Try commenting on only things that you know, and leave the rest alone!

This 8 move position is the one that IM Martin says Black must AVOID in the Patzer Variation because it is losing for Black.  But you have reached it innumerable times when it was unknown before.  And you are having difficulty as White in a winning position.  Give me another option here because frankly I don't believe you, but if you are telling the truth, you're a horrendous chess player.
  
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gjempty
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #12 - 09/22/03 at 00:23:12
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I played the Scandinavian as a child, but when I realized I was scoring 80-90% against it as white, I gave it up.  I use lines that world champions used against it, including 2...Nf6  3. Bb5+ (Fischer: trust me he played it for a good reason, and I've got analysis in one line that dates back to Staunton).

More on point against 2...Qxa5 I've played 3. Nc3 Qa5  4. Bc4 and 5. d3 a la Capablanca.  A quick Bd2 is often in order, and then, even if Black has played ...c6 for an escape route for his queen, if he has also mindlessly played the automatic ...Bf5, then Nd5-e3, followed by f4 (Nf3 is deferred) is problematic for Black.

Curiously I've also tried the 4. b4 line.  But differently than the other suggestions on here.  Notice Black's queen ends up back on ...Qd6.  Well I've countered with Ne2 and Bf4.  It's recognized as being the refutation of the 3...Qd6 line, and maybe worth a try a pawn down in the 4. b4 line.

The key things in a lot of these lines that I've learned for White is that there is no rush to bring the king knight out.  Sometimes Ne2 is better, sometimes it's better to get in f4 first.  And oh yeah, one time I was glad that I deferred Nf3 cause my queen went there in response to Black's setup with ...c6 and ...b5.  Wasn't my opponent surprised when I chopped wood on b5 Wink
  
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notagmyet
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #11 - 09/06/03 at 04:35:15
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Analysis on 4. b4 
1. e4 d5 2. exd5 Qxd5 3. Nc3 Qa5 4. b4 Qxb4 5. Rb1 Qd6 6. Nf3 Nf6 7. d4 a6! 8. Bc4 e6 9. 0-0 Be7 10. Re1 b5 11. Bb3 Bb7 12. Ng5  8)
  

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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #10 - 08/26/03 at 04:40:39
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it slightly amuses me that when the subject of the Scandinanvian comes up, gjempty throws his toys out of the pram and starts abusing everybody. In response to I like the dragon's question, 4...Qxb4 5. Rb1, and then something like Nf3, Bc4, 0-0, d4, and attack down the b-file. I'll look it up in my book on the Scandinavian and give the forum something concrete ASAP
  
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Ilikethedragon
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #9 - 08/17/03 at 16:40:22
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How do you play the 4.b4 gambit as white?
  
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #8 - 07/28/03 at 18:17:21
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I quite like Nigel Davies's idea. Why play d4 and give black a target? Bc4 and d3, leaving black with a development problem and nothing to bite on, seems quite good. I refer you to his analysis for more instruction!

Besides, 3...Qa5 4. b4! is a great gambit which I still score 100% with! 

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Tzanidakis_Michael
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #7 - 07/28/03 at 16:28:40
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I thinka that 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Qxd5 3.Nc3 Qa5 4.d4 Nf6 5.Nf3 Bf5 6.Bc4 c6 7.Bd2 Nbd7 8.Qe2 (threatening Nd5!) e6 9.d5 and white has the advantage or else "white is attacking and black is defending" and when that happens I prefer to be with the attacking side Smiley
  
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #6 - 07/28/03 at 08:36:36
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That is also what I play against 2...Nf6.  However against 2...Qxd5  3.Nc3 Qa5  4.d4 Nf6  5.Nf3 black can play 5...Bf5 and only then play ...c6.  What do you think of that? ???
  
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #5 - 07/28/03 at 05:02:52
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Though not an expert in the Scandinavian, I've played against it many times so I can tell you that one of the best lines is 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Qxd5 3.Nc3 Qa5 4.d4 Nf6 5.Nf3 c6 (it controls the b5 and d5 squares, prepares b5 and makes space for the queen. Certainly a must move!) 6.Bc4 e6 7.Bd2 Bb4 8.O-O etc. As usual I am at work and I don't have a chess board in front of me, so  please forgive me if I made any mistakes. But this is the main idea. If 2..Nf6 I prefer 3.d4 Nxd5 4.c4 Nb6 5.Nf3 Bg4. If 3.c4 or 3.Bb5+ to keep the pawn, it leads to a game that black has good game for the pawn.
  
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #4 - 07/08/03 at 00:06:27
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Thank you, gjempty, for offering the advice of playing as black; any and all advice is appreciated.
However, could you please try to address and/or attack the subject without attacking the individual? If you would care to re-read both this thread and the Patzer variation thread you might then reallize that I indeed did NOT make contradicting statements! I have not ran into the Scandinavian a great deal! In fact, I have only faced ONE opponent who uses it against me; and he has used it against me NUMEROUS times! And to boot, the exact 8 move order has indeed been repeated NUMEROUS times!-Try commenting on only things that you know, and leave the rest alone!
From your analysis of people, I can only assume that you know very little on the subject. But from your analysis of the game of chess, I can clearly see that you have valuable knowledge that could benefit others. So, I ask that you try to quit analyzing me (I'm not a troll) and instead offer some helpful advice.
Could you tell me whether 2...Qxd5; 3.Nc3 truly has potential for gaining in developement and if so, what lines are the best?
Thanx
  

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gjempty
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #3 - 07/07/03 at 22:03:10
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I'm sorry but I don't understand what 2.ed is meant to be! Either way you asked about the Scandinavian and unfortunately I'd say that you probably have more insight into the lines and variations than I do. So, I guess that I'd like to ask you for advice on the opening! I, myself, have very little interest in playing the opening but when I play as white and black chooses the Scandinavian, I have considerable difficulty. Though I've not run into it a great deal, it is a weakness that a frequent opponent of mine has picked up on and now exploits to no end! Initially I refused to capture the pawn with 2.exd5 but no matter how I atttempted to develope with this line I quickly fell into strickly defensive play. So then I began capturing with 2.exd5 with the hopes of gaining in developement when 2...Qxd5; 3.Nc3. But this never quite pans out the way that I plan either.
Good luck with your question and I hope that you or anyone else can and will offer me with some good advice.

As a side note, I can usually defend and thwart black's attacks throughout the opening, but once the the middlegame starts I find myself unable to move from defense to attack!


Now I'm starting to think you are some kind of troll.  First of all, why post a big long reply to somebody's post when you have nothing to contribute.

Secondly, I contradict your statement above that you've not run into the Scandinavian a great deal, with your reply to me in the Patzer variation thread, where you say:

"I've reached that exact 8 move order on numerous occassions"

In any event, if you have trouble against the Scandinavian, maybe you should start playing it as Black.  I used to play it as Black -- when I was a child.  This is why I'm utterly contemptuous of it now.

Sorry to the OP, though, for not being able to add anything regarding your precise variation.  Its just that it seems we have a troll on our hands.
  
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Ilikethedragon
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #2 - 07/03/03 at 17:47:25
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Thanks for your input.  By 2.ed I meant 2.exd4. Grin
  
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Re: Center-Counter/Scandinavian
Reply #1 - 07/03/03 at 07:56:48
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I'm sorry but I don't understand what 2.ed is meant to be! Either way you asked about the Scandinavian and unfortunately I'd say that you probably have more insight into the lines and variations than I do. So, I guess that I'd like to ask you for advice on the opening! I, myself, have very little interest in playing the opening but when I play as white and black chooses the Scandinavian, I have considerable difficulty. Though I've not run into it a great deal, it is a weakness that a frequent opponent of mine has picked up on and now exploits to no end! Initially I refused to capture the pawn with 2.exd5 but no matter how I atttempted to develope with this line I quickly fell into strickly defensive play. So then I began capturing with 2.exd5 with the hopes of gaining in developement when 2...Qxd5; 3.Nc3. But this never quite pans out the way that I plan either.
Good luck with your question and I hope that you or anyone else can and will offer me with some good advice.

As a side note, I can usually defend and thwart black's attacks throughout the opening, but once the the middlegame starts I find myself unable to move from defense to attack!
  

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Ilikethedragon
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Center-Counter/Scandinavian
07/03/03 at 07:27:54
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I've often played against the center-counter in tounaments but sometimes my opponent blunders his queen!  But anyway I was wondering whether the gambit (1.e4 d5  2.ed Qxd5  3.Nc3 Qa5  4.d4 e5!?  5.de Bb4  6.Bd2 Nc6) was considered playable by black.  I aslo was wondering if it was only played to win the exgange with a trap (7.a3 Nd4  8.axb4 Qxa1  9.Qxa1 Nxc2 and the knight can be trapped but not recaptured.)  If anyone has anything to say please do! Grin
  
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