Poll
Poll Question: Which team will win the English Premiership this season?
bars   pie

Arsenal    
  2 (6.5%)
Chelsea    
  9 (29.0%)
Liverpool    
  2 (6.5%)
Manchester United    
  3 (9.7%)
Bolton Wanderers    
  0 (0.0%)
Everton    
  0 (0.0%)
Wigan    
  0 (0.0%)
Another team    
  2 (6.5%)
What sport is that?    
  7 (22.6%)
Who cares, England lost to Denmark!    
  6 (19.4%)




Total votes: 31
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 14 15 [16] 17 18 ... 25
Topic Tools
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Who will win the English Premiership this season? (Read 152846 times)
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #135 - 09/11/05 at 10:08:25
Post Tools
@MNb, 

Good point on strategy.

At all:   

Wigan is ahead of Liverpool at this moment!  Ok, so Liverpool has played 3 games and Wigan has played 4 or 5.  Still, Go Liverpool and Wigan!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10780
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #134 - 09/11/05 at 02:48:22
Post Tools
In Dutch teams, when a defender brings up the ball, no midfielder will fill the open position. There will be a one to one defense. The idea is to create a majority on the midfield.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #133 - 09/10/05 at 18:11:15
Post Tools
As a soccer coach here in Colorado, I expect my midfielders to be playmakers, but I also want to see the defenders bring up the ball (with the midfielders retreating to fill in the open position) occasionally.   I think if you follow any major football league, you will see defenders doing this quite often.  And yeah, I give credit for the idea to Cruyff and the Dutch.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10780
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #132 - 09/10/05 at 16:31:59
Post Tools
"From observations over the years the playmaker is usually a midfielder."
It is true, that Beckenbauer was the first libero-playemaker, but the Dutch have a whole tradition: Epi Drost, Ruud Krol, Ronald Koeman, Danny Blind. There is a Dutch football term for it, which I can't translate:
de inschuivende libero.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #131 - 09/10/05 at 01:43:07
Post Tools
This is a bit off-topic, but I thought it might interest some of you as much as it does me.  I saw George Weah play when he should have already retired.  But I swear I saw him playing for Cameroon.  What's going on here? 

???

Quote:
George Weah: Liberia's Player of the Season?
Under international guidance, Liberia has made much progress in normalisation since its civil war ended two years ago and is preparing to hold its first national elections in eight years on 11 October. * Former World Footballer of the Year George Weah has emerged as the leading candidate among a field of 22 candidates despite having no political experience. * A Weah victory would provide a national figurehead and undermine the influence of warlord-politicians but also leaves open the possibility of manipulation by more experienced politicians with unclear agendas.
[Jane's Foreign Report - first posted to http://frp.janes.com – 6 September 2005]

  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
woofwoof
God Member
*****
Offline


chess is like life

Posts: 929
Location: Singapore
Joined: 07/04/05
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #130 - 09/10/05 at 00:38:13
Post Tools
Brazil is a bit of an anomaly, their bestest player isnt necessarily the playmaker. In 1970 Pele was the best one around but the main orchestrater was Tostao.

Again in 1982, they REALLY had a dream midfield of Zico, Socrates, Falcao & Eder. Play was orchestrated by Socrates not Zico as one might expect.

Quote:
They have five or six players on the field at any one time who would be a leader for almost any other team in the world


Yes that's right. So talent rich they are that they can have more than 1 playmaker in the team at one time eg Brazil 2002. They had Rivaldo & they had the option to add in Juninho as well. If just one of them were Singaporean, Singapore would be the most obvious one man team around!

From observations over the years the playmaker is usually a midfielder. The anomaly would then be Beckenbauer who was a libero. But then again he started operations from midfield whenever he ventured forward but he was a classy midfielder all his life before taking up the libero position.
  

"I don't make mistakes. I make prophecies which immediately turn out to be wrong." - Murray Walker
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #129 - 09/09/05 at 18:43:46
Post Tools
Woofwoof, 

If a team is limited in that way, then it has a good chance of losing at some point.  This is what makes the Brasilians so blooming amazing.  They have five or six players on the field at any one time who would be a leader for almost any other team in the world.  Yeah, Brasil has always had fantastic goal scorers, but their playmakers are what have made them the best in the world.   

Of course, Pele was so far ahead of everyone else in the world that when the English fouled him into submission in the 1966 semis, the Brasilians weren't able to recover.  One of the things the Germans did against Cruyff, apart from foul him, was to cut off his passing lanes to his teammates.  As dangerous as Cruyff was on the ball, he was made much less dangerous when he had to do it all himself.

(BTW, my least favorite teams are probably #1 Argentina, #2 Germany and #3 Portugal.  North/ United Korea is also way up there.  So when I compliment Germany, my head aches!)
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
woofwoof
God Member
*****
Offline


chess is like life

Posts: 929
Location: Singapore
Joined: 07/04/05
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #128 - 09/09/05 at 18:29:29
Post Tools
Its fairly typical of all teams to be so called a 'one man team' when there is a playmaker around; the playmaker has always been that one person who is heads & shoulders above the rest in terms of skill, tactical vision, game reading etc. So once he can stamp his authority on the game, he practically orchestrates the whole team. eg Platini, Maradona (esp so in 86), Scifo, Figo etc including Hoddle @ Spurs (my favorite English player)

Its a very common German tactic to snuff out playmakers. I watched a Euro cup final betn Bayern Munich & Porto back in the 80's - Bayern perpetually fouled Scifo. The 86 world cup final also showed the German's going after Maradona, but the Argies later switched tactics so instead of using him as a prime mover used him as a pawn to distract the Germans & let the other's exploit the Germans' distraction.
  

"I don't make mistakes. I make prophecies which immediately turn out to be wrong." - Murray Walker
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Smyslov_Fan
YaBB Moderator
Correspondence fan
*****
Offline


Progress depends on the
unreasonable man. ~GBS

Posts: 6902
Joined: 06/15/05
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #127 - 09/09/05 at 15:31:06
Post Tools
Woofwoof, 

I think you're right about it being Vogts.  I'll have to look it up, but the Dutch seemed to be just a one-person team, even with the Total Soccer concept that confused so many of their other opponents.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
woofwoof
God Member
*****
Offline


chess is like life

Posts: 929
Location: Singapore
Joined: 07/04/05
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #126 - 09/09/05 at 12:28:05
Post Tools
Quote:

...... the Orange team not able to create real chances.

Am I right to say that this happened because Vogts marked Cruyff so totally out of the game that the Oranje  lost their 'engine' & hence suffered a loss of 'edge' & ultimately their game direction?


  

"I don't make mistakes. I make prophecies which immediately turn out to be wrong." - Murray Walker
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
alumbrado
God Member
*****
Offline


Esse quam videri bonus
malebo

Posts: 1418
Location: London
Joined: 02/17/03
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #125 - 09/09/05 at 09:11:46
Post Tools
One thing I have learnt from following the English national team is, never ever write off the Germans.  They are showing signs of promise after a period when they really were in the doldrums (not least when England exorcised a few demons by administering a 5-1 thrashing in Munich Grin ).  I would not bet against them winning next year.

And on top of that, I am sorely tempted to go to the bookmaker's and place a bet on Ballack scoring the goal that eliminates England (be it in open play or a penalty shoot-out).  Of course, that assumes that England qualify for the finals ...  Undecided

The Italians are also quietly shaping up into a decent unit and shouldn't be ignored on European soil.

But of course, after Greece winning Euro 2004 and plenty of surprise results in the 2002 World Cup, it may be that we are in for a shock next year, too.
  

If sometimes we fly too close to the sun, at least this shows we are spreading our wings.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10780
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #124 - 09/09/05 at 06:55:39
Post Tools
I just wonder if Alumbrado's memories of 1996 are as good as his memories of the 1982 match at Wembley, with two goals by Jantje Peeters ...
The Orange team is not only one of the few to beat the Germans at home (East-Germany beat West-Germany in the opening match of 1974, goal by Jürgen Sparwasser), it also one of the few to beat the English at their home temple. I believe, Scotland managed to do the same once.
I clearly remember the infamous 1974 finals. I was on holiday in the Alsace and watched it with a German hotel guest. As a 12 year old boy, how I enjoyed the first couple of minutes, ultimate domination by the Dutch! And how I cursed Gerd Müller's goal! During the second half I slowly sank in despair, the Orange team not able to create real chances. With tears in my eyes, staring to the ground, I had to congradulate the German adult. Ah, those were the days.
Many years later I have reseen the match and now I have to admit, that on the whole the Germans in fact were better and deserved to win.
Last couple of years I have noticed, that the classical football countries are in trouble. Neither the Dutch, the Germans, the English nor the French play impressive lately. Will we see Argentina-Brasil in the finals next year?
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Willempie
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing
.com!

Posts: 4312
Location: Holland
Joined: 01/07/05
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #123 - 09/09/05 at 05:06:07
Post Tools
If it is any consolation, I was about the only person who thought we would win the penalty series, the rest (I was in the pub) was watching it in despair.
I think this was the only time together with 88, we didnt screw it up (or got screwed). 

Indeed a very nice goal by Zlatan (though one of his last Ajax goals was even more brilliant).
  

If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TalJechin
God Member
*****
Offline


There is no secret ingredient.

Posts: 2892
Location: Malmö
Joined: 08/12/04
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #122 - 09/09/05 at 04:39:00
Post Tools
Well, the dutch got lucky last time, in the euro ch  Cry

Btw, Sweden is very near to being qualified for Germany next year thanks to Zlatan's impossible goal in Budapest. As Croatia only managed 1-1 with Malta, we now lead the group and a win in the last round against Iceland should secure at least a 2nd place with the best goal score, and a win or draw in Croatia before that would ensure a ticket to Deutschland... Cheesy
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
alumbrado
God Member
*****
Offline


Esse quam videri bonus
malebo

Posts: 1418
Location: London
Joined: 02/17/03
Gender: Male
Re: Who will win the English Premiership this seas
Reply #121 - 09/09/05 at 04:16:45
Post Tools
It must be said that both the Dutch and the English have a sorry tale to tell with regard to penalty shoot outs in major tournaments Sad
  

If sometimes we fly too close to the sun, at least this shows we are spreading our wings.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 14 15 [16] 17 18 ... 25
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo