Poll
Poll closed Question: Prediction?
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*** This poll has now closed ***


Topalov wins    
  23 (29.1%)
Kramnik wins    
  37 (46.8%)
Draw    
  2 (2.5%)
Match gets cancelled    
  17 (21.5%)
other?...    
  0 (0.0%)




Total votes: 79
« Created by: OstapBender on: 05/25/06 at 17:35:43 »
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Kramnik-Topalov match (Read 89166 times)
Keano
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #784 - 10/08/06 at 13:43:38
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Now it will be Topalovs turn to react to defeat - only 2 games left after this and he is Black in the last one again, so next game will be very important for him to come out firing.
  
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Keano
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #783 - 10/08/06 at 13:36:26
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24...Bxb5 looked sensible no? If White has an edge it must be microscopic there.

It looks like the nerves have got to Topalov as I predicted might happen the nearer we get to the finish line.
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #782 - 10/08/06 at 13:32:31
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24...f6 was a blunder (played quickly like other moves).  Unbelievable!  Kramnik could win this one!

Klick, I gotta learn that trick of yours for posting such diagrams (a screen capture?).
  

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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #781 - 10/08/06 at 13:28:20
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I just connected and no commentary here today? Is Kramnik not just winning now (after ...f6) It looked like he had some pressure anyway - so could we have the immediate comeback? The Kramnik supporters had given up already, but looks like he is coming back strong  Cool
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #780 - 10/08/06 at 13:28:02
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #779 - 10/08/06 at 11:28:24
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11...b5!? This looks like good prep from the Topalov team again - now if 12.b3 then I suppose ...a4 and everything is place. So 12.c5!? f5!? with a strange stonewall that looks at least OK for Black to me...

The pattern is continuing - Toppy has used 2 mins, Kramnik 25 mins so far
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #778 - 10/08/06 at 11:12:43
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Game 10 is on - 9....a5!? Has made Kramnik think again. More normal is ...b6
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #777 - 10/08/06 at 11:00:10
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Another interesting Kramnik quote: So far my openings are disastrous. It is easy to play good in good positions, and vice versa. If I manage solving my opening problems, everything should be different.
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #776 - 10/08/06 at 10:58:11
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Press Conferences are on official page now, apparently Kramnik was confident and relaxed again despite his second loss (I presume he is putting some energy into maintaining a front but I could be wrong). On the game he said  After the opening, I continued resisting because it was inconvenient for me to resign that early, but the game was basically decided by the move 17
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #775 - 10/08/06 at 04:20:39
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TopNotch wrote on 10/08/06 at 01:38:55:
What ?! - No press conferences today?  Huh

Topper Smiley


Really?  Usually there is a delay of a day or so before they are translated and posted at the official page, but I assume that there was a press conference (probably with K and T separated again).

Well, Kramnik played some of his best when -1 against Leko -- I wonder, though, if he still has it in him.  Either he will have to dig deep into his opening bag of tricks, or find a way to grind Topalov down, but his judgement has not been good in the past two games.
  
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #774 - 10/08/06 at 04:05:01
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THE SLIMING OF A CHAMPION

A RAVE by Jeremy Silman

As most of you already know, after falling behind 3-1 the Topalov team, clearly in a state of panic, accused Kramnik of cheating. Apparently, the only reason Kramnik would use his private toilet would be to share quality time with Fritz 9 or some other top chess engine. That's what toilets are for, right?

Since there was absolutely no proof of any cheating going on, the appeals committee showed their high moral fiber and punished Kramnik in various ways. Oddly, Kramnik didn't appreciate being slimed by thugs Danailov (the head of Team Topalov), Makropoulos (Appeals Committee), and Azmaiparashvili (Appeals Committee). Thus he refused to play game five until the mess was worked out and apologies were offered. As a result, he was forfeited (he was due to have the White pieces).

This is what I wrote to ChessBase at that time:

Let's get this straight. The Topalov gang of thugs ... err ... I    mean camp, realizing that it is about to lose the title, comes up with outrageous (as in illogical, unproven, nonsensical) accusations designed to get into Kramnik's head. The appeals committee, made up of Topalov supporters, side with their buddies (an illegal act, if one believes that signed contracts are worth the paper they are printed on). Kramnik, to his credit, refuses to cave in to this amateurish and criminal attempt to steal the match. Correctly, he also refuses to play game five since it would give credence to the madness tossed his way. The mighty leader of FIDE returns, gets rid of the appeals committee, and reinstates the bathrooms. Doing this clearly says, "The whole affair was handled incorrectly." And now we are told that the match will continue with the forfeit standing! In other words, the despicable behavior of the Topey squad isn't punished in any way, while Kramnik gets body slammed by forfeiting a key game!? Perhaps Kirsan was only giving us a false show of trying to set things right since Kramnik would be foolish to play when faced with such idiocy. Thus, the FIDE Champion (who supported Ilyumzhinov in the elections) will retain his title, semi-human cretins like Danailov will learn that such actions will always be rewarded, and the one man that didn't do anything to anyone (Kramnik) will be crushed. What a joke!

One final point: Throughout my career in chess, I've known many players that constantly rush to the bathroom. Minor medical conditions, compounded with nerves and the constant imbibing of liquids, make this a fairly common occurrence. To claim that Kramnik's toilet use is proof that he is using a 1200 rated computer (How else to explain it allowing its human to be mated in three?) is laughable, which is how the appeals committee should have reacted to the Topalov camp's little joke. From this day forth, when one player tries to slime another, it will be said that "So and so is trying to Topalov his opponent!" or, taking a page from boxing lore, "It's a Tope-a-Dope!" 

As a result of this, Kramink ended up with three Blacks in a row (a Black before the forfeit, and two further Black's after it). Most players would walk out of the match, but the Classical World Champion showed his class when he decided to continue with a 3-2 lead. 

After easily holding a draw in game six, that paragon of virtue Danailov tried once again to disturb Kramnik by claiming that, "After very detailed analysis of all games of the match, we would like to present to your attention coincidence statistics of the moves of GM Kramnik with recommendations of chess program Fritz 9."

Danailov showed that Kramnik's moves match the first choice of Fritz 9 78% of the time.

Mark Crowther's comment mirrored my own state of mind perfectly: "I'm sorry but this is one of the most stupid press releases I've ever seen."

Sadly, many players and most certainly the ignorant public will take this as a sure sign that Kramnik is cheating. However, it really shows that Kramnik is not cheating at all! To prove this point I played through a Keres game from 1957, using Fritz 9 to scan every move. After the opening theory was past, I got the following stats for the final 29 moves:

24 Fritz FIRST CHOICES
2 Fritz SECOND CHOICES (which were just a tad weaker than its first choice)
1 Fritz THIRD CHOICE (which also was strong)
2 moves that Fritz didn't care for

These statistics show, without any doubt (if we follow the thug's reasoning), that: Keres was using Fritz 9 in 1957!!!! AND he used it more often (at least in this game) than Kramnik does!

OR -- and this is a stretch -- could it be that world-class players play world-class moves?

By the way, most of Topalov's moves are also Fritz 9 thumbs up choices. My god! Could it be that BOTH players are cheating?

In my opinion, Topalov should be held accountable for the deplorable behavior of his pet thug. And FIDE should be ashamed of itself for allowing this kind of sick, despicable character assassination to take place. The fact that they actually rewarded team Topalov shows where their loyalties lie.

Tops Smiley
  

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TopNotch
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #773 - 10/08/06 at 02:00:50
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Buzz wrote on 10/08/06 at 01:48:51:
All of this is most entertaining Cheesy This is how I see things as far as the conduct of the match so far. The definition of a Profesional athlete, poker player, chess player, etc. means they are expected to perform at top level 99% of the time irregardless of the circumstances. This is what seperates champions from just 'the very good.' In all sports the 'headgames' are played and used by all of the very best. The better player does not allow himself to be 'psyched out.' Don't get me wrong either I'M not a fan of Topa's but Kramnik has allowed himself to be taken out of form. The 'psych' job used by Toppa's team is rather low but such tactics have been used in all sporting events and they are a part of the modern compitition scene...love them or hate them.....

I would like to see Kramnik get the job done but I had to question his protest by sitting out game #5 and thereby losing that whole point. I think it was a knucklehead move on Kram's part but I guess he had his reasons but he may think quite differently in a couple of years (he may never admit it though). Kram needs to just settle in and fight like all hell. Despite all of this controversy I think it is good for the competitive aspect of the sport! All great sports have great famous rivals! SO lets enjoy the rest of this match.....


Thanks for this very inciteful post.

Indeed why bother to even have athletes sign contracts at all binding them to certain obligations, after all regardless of whether the contract is broken or not, it doesn't matter, they are still expected to perform at top level 99% of the time.

Furthermore if the contract is broken to your detriment, that should motivate you to perform even better, after all you are a professional. I wonder how many of us professionals in other fields share this inciteful view.

Once again very astute post Buzz. Grin
 

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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #772 - 10/08/06 at 01:48:51
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All of this is most entertaining Cheesy This is how I see things as far as the conduct of the match so far. The definition of a Profesional athlete, poker player, chess player, etc. means they are expected to perform at top level 99% of the time irregardless of the circumstances. This is what seperates champions from just 'the very good.' In all sports the 'headgames' are played and used by all of the very best. The better player does not allow himself to be 'psyched out.' Don't get me wrong either I'M not a fan of Topa's but Kramnik has allowed himself to be taken out of form. The 'psych' job used by Toppa's team is rather low but such tactics have been used in all sporting events and they are a part of the modern compitition scene...love them or hate them.....

I would like to see Kramnik get the job done but I had to question his protest by sitting out game #5 and thereby losing that whole point. I think it was a knucklehead move on Kram's part but I guess he had his reasons but he may think quite differently in a couple of years (he may never admit it though). Kram needs to just settle in and fight like all hell. Despite all of this controversy I think it is good for the competitive aspect of the sport! All great sports have great famous rivals! SO lets enjoy the rest of this match.....
  
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TopNotch
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #771 - 10/08/06 at 01:38:55
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What ?! - No press conferences today?  Huh

Topper Smiley
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
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TopNotch
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Re: Kramnik-Topalov match
Reply #770 - 10/08/06 at 01:35:42
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Keano wrote on 10/07/06 at 14:44:20:

My personal opinion is that Topalov will win, but I am not writing Kramnik off by any means - he has to rise to the occasion though that is for sure, and concentrate solely on the chess. It is up to his team and those around him to help him in this.


Hedging your bets and sitting on the fence as usual.

It wasn't naive at all to think that going 2-0 down to a player of Kraminik's calibre insurmountable to overcome, but who in their wildest dreams could have predicted the desperate means that Topalov would resort to to get back in the match.

The way you analyse and talk about this match one would think that it has been played on an equal and fair footing.

Now who really is the one being naive.

So Topalov retains a tainted title and Kramnik wins the respect and admiration of millions around the chess world. Thankfully those that dismiss Topalov's behaviour as all part n parcel of a sporting contest, and one just needs to be tough and ignore these things, are in the minority.

Tops Smiley

 

       
  

The man who tries to do something and fails is infinitely better than he who tries to do nothing and succeeds - Lloyd Jones Smiley
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