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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Topalov has lost it (Read 28258 times)
ANDREW BRETT
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #87 - 11/09/07 at 13:16:14
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MNb wrote on 10/07/07 at 21:13:07:
I am a fan of Topalov's chess and I agree. I sincerely hope he will take up the race for the title again, behind the board that is.


Well given that all he has to do is win a match v a winner of the grand prix to play the winner of anand v kramnik I am sure he will !
  
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Antillian
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #86 - 11/09/07 at 13:03:35
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Markovich wrote on 11/08/07 at 13:51:38:


It was favor, not flavor, right?  But in any case, my suspicion is that Kramnik's meaning was ironic.  "I gave him the title," as in self-criticism.  Still, its bad form to denigrate a competition in which you have just been defeated.  But its pretty small potatoes, especially for top-level chess.  I certainly wouldn't refuse to shake Kramnik's hand over it.  My attitude about Topalov as well.

They say that Kathleen Battle is a total b---h, but with that voice, who gives a d--n?


Right - Favour, correct.

While Kramnik may have been somewhat ungracious, the general sense seems to be be that Chessbase sensationalized Kramnik's  comments then. They seem to have also sensationlized Annand's response with the headline "Anand blasts FIDE's 'political patronage' of Kramnik". When you read the interview, with Anand, this is not the sense that I got.
  

"Breakthrough results come about by a series of good decisions, diligently executed and accumulated one on top of another." Jim Collins --- Good to Great
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Markovich
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #85 - 11/08/07 at 13:51:38
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Antillian wrote on 11/08/07 at 11:45:07:
Smyslov_Fan wrote on 11/08/07 at 05:46:58:
Kramnik's comments are indeed disappointing, but the original Russian has a slightly different flavor than the article in Chessbase makes out.

Kramnik's verb choice was more "I favored Anand with the title" than "I loaned him the title".  I think Kramnik was trying to put a positive spin on the World Championship and maintain that he has a right to the scheduled match rather than to denigrate Anand's achievement.  ChessBase made Kramnik sound a bit more pig-headed than he probably deserved. 

But who can blame ChessBase?  They not only made sensational headlines, but even had the acumen to give the original Russian for us to verify what he actually said.   Shocked


The phrase "i flavoured Anand with the title" means little in English. I assume that it the literal translation from Russian. Unfortunately literal translations never convey accurately what is being said. Can anyone say what would be the most  appropriate translation of this in modern English?


It was favor, not flavor, right?  But in any case, my suspicion is that Kramnik's meaning was ironic.  "I gave him the title," as in self-criticism.  Still, its bad form to denigrate a competition in which you have just been defeated.  But its pretty small potatoes, especially for top-level chess.  I certainly wouldn't refuse to shake Kramnik's hand over it.  My attitude about Topalov as well.

They say that Kathleen Battle is a total b---h, but with that voice, who gives a d--n?
  

The Great Oz has spoken!
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Antillian
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #84 - 11/08/07 at 11:45:07
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 11/08/07 at 05:46:58:
Kramnik's comments are indeed disappointing, but the original Russian has a slightly different flavor than the article in Chessbase makes out.

Kramnik's verb choice was more "I favored Anand with the title" than "I loaned him the title".  I think Kramnik was trying to put a positive spin on the World Championship and maintain that he has a right to the scheduled match rather than to denigrate Anand's achievement.  ChessBase made Kramnik sound a bit more pig-headed than he probably deserved. 

But who can blame ChessBase?  They not only made sensational headlines, but even had the acumen to give the original Russian for us to verify what he actually said.   Shocked


The phrase "i flavoured Anand with the title" means little in English. I assume that it the literal translation from Russian. Unfortunately literal translations never convey accurately what is being said. Can anyone say what would be the most  appropriate translation of this in modern English?
  

"Breakthrough results come about by a series of good decisions, diligently executed and accumulated one on top of another." Jim Collins --- Good to Great
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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #83 - 11/08/07 at 05:46:58
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Kramnik's comments are indeed disappointing, but the original Russian has a slightly different flavor than the article in Chessbase makes out.

Kramnik's verb choice was more "I favored Anand with the title" than "I loaned him the title".  I think Kramnik was trying to put a positive spin on the World Championship and maintain that he has a right to the scheduled match rather than to denigrate Anand's achievement.  ChessBase made Kramnik sound a bit more pig-headed than he probably deserved.  

But who can blame ChessBase?  They not only made sensational headlines, but even had the acumen to give the original Russian for us to verify what he actually said.   Shocked
  
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alumbrado
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #82 - 11/07/07 at 20:31:15
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When it comes to the World Chess Championship we should heed Thomas Jefferson's advice: "Put not your faith in men, but bind them down with the chains of the Constitution".  Too bad FIDE is manifestly not up to the job.
  

If sometimes we fly too close to the sun, at least this shows we are spreading our wings.
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #81 - 11/07/07 at 18:58:36
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Antillian wrote on 11/07/07 at 15:56:34:
Keano wrote on 11/07/07 at 15:35:46:
How is it that Kramniks comments dont surprise me. Unfortunately he has been consistently self-serving and ungracious in the past and is consistent in this path. A great player, but his actions away from the board have never inspired me.


For once, I agree somewhat with Keano. Kramnik's comments are disappointing.


Yes, particularly since Kramnik played, and finished behind Anand, in this supposedly not-so-important tournament.  But perhaps his eventual results will back up his words.
  

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Antillian
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #80 - 11/07/07 at 15:56:34
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Keano wrote on 11/07/07 at 15:35:46:
How is it that Kramniks comments dont surprise me. Unfortunately he has been consistently self-serving and ungracious in the past and is consistent in this path. A great player, but his actions away from the board have never inspired me.


For once, I agree somewhat with Keano. Kramnik's comments are disappointing.
  

"Breakthrough results come about by a series of good decisions, diligently executed and accumulated one on top of another." Jim Collins --- Good to Great
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Keano
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #79 - 11/07/07 at 15:35:46
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How is it that Kramniks comments dont surprise me. Unfortunately he has been consistently self-serving and ungracious in the past and is consistent in this path. A great player, but his actions away from the board have never inspired me.
  
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #78 - 11/06/07 at 15:35:39
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Keano wrote on 11/05/07 at 12:43:08:
I went away a bit and missed all the sniping! Good to see I manged to provoke a bit of discussion, but lets all calm down a bit... I may have been a bit over the top in my anti-Silman attack but personally I think it was a tasteless review and he used it as an opportunity for pushing his own views. Whatever, I agree with Smyslov_fan, lets not get so worked up and stick to a few beers in the pub  Wink

More sniping! Otherwise Mnb and me have to resort to our eternal arguments about Dutch football and the Giuoco. Cheesy

In any case a new one has started seemingly, this time not featuring Toppy, but some real sportmanship comments from the ex-Wch:
http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=4231
  

If nothing else works, a total pig-headed unwillingness to look facts in the face will see us through.
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #77 - 11/05/07 at 21:00:11
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Cheers. Even after a few tasty beers I disagree.  Wink
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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Keano
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #76 - 11/05/07 at 12:43:08
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I went away a bit and missed all the sniping! Good to see I manged to provoke a bit of discussion, but lets all calm down a bit... I may have been a bit over the top in my anti-Silman attack but personally I think it was a tasteless review and he used it as an opportunity for pushing his own views. Whatever, I agree with Smyslov_fan, lets not get so worked up and stick to a few beers in the pub  Wink
  
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MNb
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #75 - 10/07/07 at 21:13:07
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I am a fan of Topalov's chess and I agree. I sincerely hope he will take up the race for the title again, behind the board that is.
  

The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
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micawber
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #74 - 10/07/07 at 15:03:09
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Personally,

I am a Topalov-fan and not ashamed off it. But I think it's time to put Elista and the subsequent antics behind us (that goes for Topalov too). So no comments from me about who didnt do what and accused whom.
I am satisfied that Anand is the current world champion, and hope for the chessworld that he can hold on to his title the next few years.

  
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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Topalov has lost it
Reply #73 - 10/07/07 at 08:47:22
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Personally,

I don't mind a book reviewer inserting his own opinions into a review as long as they pertain to the material covered.  I read the New York Times Book Review every week and regularly peruse professional reviews (of history) .  I prefer reviews that are written by experts in a given field and which present a book from a point of view rather than those that pretend to a false objectivity that can never be.  I want the book put into a social and cultural context by the reviewer.

I've found Silman's reviews to be rather uneven, but his review of Topalov's book was excellent because he achieved the twin goals of any good review:  a) he informed the reader of the content of the book in an interesting way and b) he provided the reader with an informed discussion of the material covered in the book.  

In other words, what Willempie sees as a drawback of Silman's review is exactly what I look for in an exceptional review.  

Willempie,

Your English is fantastic!  You made your point quite clearly.  I disagree with you, but you don't need a speechwriter. Cool
  
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