What´s up with 6. ... Qe8!? - Wasnt it an idea by Kupreichik to avoid the exchange variation? In the late ´90s it scored quite well.

Marc Narciso wrote on 05/30/07 at 21:59:31:


I'm just armchairing here, but White has to be pretty good after, say, 7...Nb4 8 Be3 and 9 Nd4-b5?  What is the knight doing on b4 that it couldn't have done on b8?

I was recently looking for an alternative for black to the main line and decided to look at 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. Nf3 O-O 6. Be2 e5 7. O-O Na6.  However, I found the simple exchange variation 8. dxe5 dxe5 9. Qc2 was not to my liking. 
 
I remembered reading the name of this thread once and decided to take a look at an on line database for some ideas.  I found that  the seldom played 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. Nf3 O-O 6. Be2 a5 7. O-O Na6  has been played by some very strong players on both sides of the board and black seems to hold up fairly well.  Against the white alternative   6. Be2 a5 7. Be3, Fritz 10 found 7...Ng4 8. Bg5 h6 9. Bh4 Na6 adequate for black.

So this got me to thinking that delaying the central …e5 (or …c5) counterattack until after …a5 and …Na6 have been played just might make for some very interesting chess.  I suppose the main threat would be white’s e5 thrust.  

Anyway, I haven’t gotten very are along yet but I thought I’d put this idea out there and see how others react and if anyone out there has any experience with this idea.

Yes, 8.0-0 e5 seems the most natural, when either 9.Bg5 a la Petrosian or 9.Ne1 a la the Classical seem like they'd give White better versions of what he usually gets.  Kasparov faced this in a simul once and chose: 9.Ne1 Nbd7 10.Nd3 Ne8 11.Be3 f5 12.f3 f4 13.Bf2 g5 14.b4 Ndf6 15.c5.

I'm reviving this line because I've just faced the same line twice in serious play.  I lost the first and won the second, both because of, but not in the opening.

Here are the moves:1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.e4 d6 5.Be2 0-0 6.Nf3 Nc6?!/!? 7.d5 Nb8!?

In the first game I tried 8.Ne1? and just got on the bad side of a classic king-side attack.  I tried 8.Bg5 the second time and earned a slight advantage.

I wanted to play 8.Be3, which appears to be the main line, but all the analysis I've seen suggests this is just not adequate for more than a miniscule advantage with best play.

I had always thought this was just a waste of time, and the books I have confirm this bias.  However, when I studied the lines in more depth it became obvious that the most White can hope for is more space and nagging pressure.  Black can hope for favorable transpositions to all sorts of weird KID positions which are very unclear.

I remember Jesse Kraai used to teach this opening to his students, and I used to crush them. (I only played one game against Jesse Kraai himself, and got clobbered as Black.) But there's been a revival on the internet of this perversely pernicious line.

Does anyone have an antidote that really seems to work well?

I always play the exchange variation with white! (instead of Be2 I use h3, according to Grivas it has some advantages). Black needs to now some theory as otherwise he will be worse. I use it specially against stronger players. I think that the exchange is equal if black plays it accuratly, and if you play the mainline with white you come into the garden of black.

Against weaker players I use the Petrosian line, d5. Very strategic

Marc,
I finally found the site I was thinking about - but it does NOT cover the line you suggested 

It deals with 6.-,e5 7. O-O Nc6 8.d5 Nd4!??
If you are interested here it is: http://www.davidlevinchess.com/ under Opening theory.