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Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? (Read 6995 times)

yzfool YaBB Newbies Offline I love Schopenhauer! Posts: 43 Location: Atlanta Joined: 03/01/03	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #8 - 11/06/07 at 15:36:38	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: Quote: THe difference is that you play a Bird with white and that you have an extra-tempo Well yes of course, but I know of at least one Grandmaster who thinks more highly of 7...c6 than 7...Qe8. I certainly don't claim to know which one is better. Both options still seem viable to me. Is there a line of play for White that casts doubt on 7...c6's solid reputation? No there isn't. The position tends to lead to pawn symmetry and therefore (supposedly) to a lack of the dynamic play Black "expects" in the Dutch. I haven't played anyone in 30 years who had the ability to staunch dynamic play in ANY symmetrical position out of the opening, including the Slav Exchange. Typically, no pieces are exchanged in this opening. Where there are pieces, there are tactics. That's what matters to me.


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Black_Widow Full Member Offline I love ChessPublishing .com! Posts: 164 Location: Veenendaal Joined: 03/04/05 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #7 - 09/12/07 at 21:07:53	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: Quote: THe difference is that you play a Bird with white and that you have an extra-tempo Well yes of course, but I know of at least one Grandmaster who thinks more highly of 7...c6 than 7...Qe8. I certainly don't claim to know which one is better. Both options still seem viable to me. Is there a line of play for White that casts doubt on 7...c6's solid reputation? With a Leningrad Bird I prefer c3 in combination with Na3, since it is easier to maintain the tension. After Qe1, the black fianchetto with Bb7 is annoying, since it is very solid for black. With the Leningrad I prefer Qe8, since it gives black a lot of flexibility and dynanism. Although the c6-variations are nice, but after an early d5 of white, it is time to seek the drawish variations, if you want to maintain the balance.


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Glenn Snow God Member Offline Posts: 1720 Location: Franklin Joined: 09/27/03 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #6 - 09/12/07 at 19:24:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: THe difference is that you play a Bird with white and that you have an extra-tempo Well yes of course, but I know of at least one Grandmaster who thinks more highly of 7...c6 than 7...Qe8. I certainly don't claim to know which one is better. Both options still seem viable to me. Is there a line of play for White that casts doubt on 7...c6's solid reputation?


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thibdb13 God Member Offline Tal was the best Posts: 974 Location: Mechelen Joined: 01/25/07 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #5 - 09/12/07 at 10:44:50	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: Quote: Do you know why the move 1.d4 f5 2.g3 Nf6 3.Bg2 g6 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.0-0 0-0 6.c4 d6 7.Nc3 ç6 is almost no more played ? Qe8 or Nc6 are now prefered to the "old" ç6, is there any concrete reason or is it only chess fashion ? I've been looking again at 7...c6 again lately too and for now at least I rather like it. I'm not sure it's any less flexible than 7...Qe8, it's just that different options are retained. For instance with ...c6 Black can choose to move his Queen not only to ...Qe8 but also ...Qc7 or ...Qa5. In Danielson's "Polar Bear System" where he advocates using the Reversed Leningrad he prefers using c3 and Na3 to attempt an advantage. THe difference is that you play a Bird with white and that you have an extra-tempo

	Yusupov once said that “The problem with the Dutch Defence is that later in many positions the best move would be ...f5-f7” but he is surely wrong.
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Glenn Snow God Member Offline Posts: 1720 Location: Franklin Joined: 09/27/03 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #4 - 09/12/07 at 09:16:54	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: Do you know why the move 1.d4 f5 2.g3 Nf6 3.Bg2 g6 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.0-0 0-0 6.c4 d6 7.Nc3 ç6 is almost no more played ? Qe8 or Nc6 are now prefered to the "old" ç6, is there any concrete reason or is it only chess fashion ? I've been looking again at 7...c6 again lately too and for now at least I rather like it. I'm not sure it's any less flexible than 7...Qe8, it's just that different options are retained. For instance with ...c6 Black can choose to move his Queen not only to ...Qe8 but also ...Qc7 or ...Qa5. In Danielson's "Polar Bear System" where he advocates using the Reversed Leningrad he prefers using c3 and Na3 to attempt an advantage.


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parisestmagique Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 473 Location: paris Joined: 01/24/06 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #3 - 09/10/07 at 14:30:45	Post Tools	Print Post
	Do you know the critical line for Black after 1.d4 f5 2.g3 Nf6 3.Bg2 g6 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.0-0 0-0 6.c4 d6 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.d5 Na5


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thibdb13 God Member Offline Tal was the best Posts: 974 Location: Mechelen Joined: 01/25/07 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #2 - 09/07/07 at 17:37:15	Post Tools	Print Post
	parisestmagique wrote on 09/06/07 at 10:12:02: Do you know why the move 1.d4 f5 2.g3 Nf6 3.Bg2 g6 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.0-0 0-0 6.c4 d6 7.Nc3 ç6 is almost no more played ? Qe8 or Nc6 are now prefered to the "old" ç6, is there any concrete reason or is it only chess fashion ? You can always play c6 later. Qe8 is more flexible and nc6 can be very annoying if white does not know what to do.

	Yusupov once said that “The problem with the Dutch Defence is that later in many positions the best move would be ...f5-f7” but he is surely wrong.
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TalJechin God Member Offline There is no secret ingredient. Posts: 2892 Location: Malmö Joined: 08/12/04 Gender:	Re: Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? Reply #1 - 09/06/07 at 16:32:52	Post Tools	Print Post
	Iirc we've discussed the merits of the 7th move options a couple of years ago, and then the general opinion seemed to be that 7...c6 was too drawish. Personally, I doubt a little solidity could be wrong in the Dutch - but I have very little experience with ...c6. (Though taking a closer look at it has been on my 'to do list' for the past few years... )


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parisestmagique Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 473 Location: paris Joined: 01/24/06 Gender:	Dutch Leningrad why ç6 is no more played ? 09/06/07 at 10:12:02	Post Tools	Print Post
	Do you know why the move 1.d4 f5 2.g3 Nf6 3.Bg2 g6 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.0-0 0-0 6.c4 d6 7.Nc3 ç6 is almost no more played ? Qe8 or Nc6 are now prefered to the "old" ç6, is there any concrete reason or is it only chess fashion ?


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