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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon (Read 72924 times)
IM Andrew Greet
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #45 - 03/13/08 at 20:46:05
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FightingDragon wrote on 01/08/08 at 13:29:28:
IM Andrew Greet wrote on 01/02/08 at 00:31:07:
Anyways, after 3.c3 I decided to advocate 3...d5!? for Black, leading after 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.d4 Bg7 to what is technically a variation of the Alapin in which Black has good prospects for active counterplay. I also conclude that 4.Qxd4, while interesting, should not worry Black unduly.


That means your book can also be used as a starting point for a 'Dragonesque' black defence against the Alapin variation, as after 1.e4 c5 2.c3 d5 3.ed5: Qd5: 4.d4 g6 the move played most often is 5.Nf3 which directly transposes.
Currently I use 2. ... g6 only as a surprise weapon because I think that 4.Qd4 creates problems for black after both 5.e5 and 5.Nc3.
How much space does the chapter on the Hyper-Accelerated Dragon take compared to the space of the whole book?

Is the variation 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 g6 3.c4 Bg7 4.d4 cd4: 5.Nd4: Nc6 6.Be3 Nf6 7.Nc3 0-0 8.Be2 b6 9.0-0 Bb7 10.f3 e6 with a quick d7-d5 also discussed in the book?
I think it is one of the most promising possibilities for black against the Maroczy!

I'm really looking forward to the book  Smiley, when will it be released?


Just realised I never replied to this. To answer your questions:
- The H.A.D. chapter is 40 pages, mainly giving advice for White against 3.d4 Bg7 and for Black against deviations such as 3.c3, 3.d4 cxd4 4.Qxd4!? and others. Deciding between the 2...Nc6 and 2...g6 move orders is a big decision and I have explained quite thoroughly the pros and cons of each.
- The double fianchetto is also covered, including the 10...e6!? line. I think White can obtain a small plus here, but agree that it is quite playable for Black.

Finally, MNb, I also consider 10.Bd3 to be a good choice against 9...e5; less theoretical than 9.Nb5, and according to my analysis it probably gives better chances of an advantage as well.
  
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IM Andrew Greet
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #44 - 03/13/08 at 20:34:59
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Finally we are nearing publication! Apparently Everyman had a number of other books all being completed at around the same time, which led to a bit of a delay with the editing/typesetting. All being well, it should be on the shelves by the end of the month.

I'm afraid that by comparison with Play The Ruy Lopez it is something of a lightweight, comprising only the mere total of 320 pages!  Smiley (apparently this is a record for a Starting Out book)
  
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MNb
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #43 - 02/18/08 at 02:34:22
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The most fighting version of the Acc. Dragon is by far 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.c4 Bg7 6.Be3 Nf6 7.Nc3 Ng4 8.Qxg4 Nxd4 9.Qd1 e5. Last time I mentioned this variation somebody replied that 10.Bd3 0-0 11.0-0 promises White a lasting advantage. I never cared to check this.

I am not sure about transpositions via the Benoni and the English.
1.c4 c5 2.Nc3 Nc6 3.Nf3 g6 4.d4 does not transpose, though that might be in Black's advantage after cxd4 5.Nxd4 Bg7 6.Nc3 Bxc3+!? is Nf6. But there is also 4.e3.
1.c4 c5 2.Nc3 g6 3.Nf3 Bg7 4.d4 cxd4 5.Nxd4 Nf6 6.e4 Nc6 7.Be3 transposes though.
So does 1.c4 c5 2.Nf3 Nf6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.Nc3 Bg7 6.e4 Nc6 7.Be3. Here Black of course has 4...e5!? so you might ask yourself if it is really necessary to add the Acc. Dragon. If done so many times but never found a good answer.
  
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flaviddude
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #42 - 02/18/08 at 01:44:27
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You should take a look at the Opening for White According to Kramnik series (can't remember which volume) - or Davies' Dynamic Réti - both of which come to it via 1.Nf3 etc rather than 1.e4 [/quote]

I play the full tilt Benoni and dragon. I got lured into the Maroczy Bind from the Benoni by an Aussie GM who ground me into the dirt. I am thinking of taking up the accelerated dragon and hyper accelerated dragon for over the board play.

As long as I can hold the dreaded bind then I do not need to try and avoid it.

I am going to have to buy one or two books on the accelerated dragon. Meanwhile so that I can start preparing lines which is the most fighting line for black against the bind at the present time.

Thank you
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #41 - 02/17/08 at 15:34:09
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New publication dates:

Published March 2008 EU, April 2008 US
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #40 - 01/10/08 at 10:38:43
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Publication date is now Feb!
Not much evidence of acceleration ...
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #39 - 01/08/08 at 13:29:28
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IM Andrew Greet wrote on 01/02/08 at 00:31:07:
Anyways, after 3.c3 I decided to advocate 3...d5!? for Black, leading after 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.d4 Bg7 to what is technically a variation of the Alapin in which Black has good prospects for active counterplay. I also conclude that 4.Qxd4, while interesting, should not worry Black unduly.


That means your book can also be used as a starting point for a 'Dragonesque' black defence against the Alapin variation, as after 1.e4 c5 2.c3 d5 3.ed5: Qd5: 4.d4 g6 the move played most often is 5.Nf3 which directly transposes.
Currently I use 2. ... g6 only as a surprise weapon because I think that 4.Qd4 creates problems for black after both 5.e5 and 5.Nc3.
How much space does the chapter on the Hyper-Accelerated Dragon take compared to the space of the whole book?

Is the variation 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 g6 3.c4 Bg7 4.d4 cd4: 5.Nd4: Nc6 6.Be3 Nf6 7.Nc3 0-0 8.Be2 b6 9.0-0 Bb7 10.f3 e6 with a quick d7-d5 also discussed in the book?
I think it is one of the most promising possibilities for black against the Maroczy!

I'm really looking forward to the book  Smiley, when will it be released?
  
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IM Andrew Greet
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #38 - 01/05/08 at 23:34:56
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jaki wrote on 01/02/08 at 09:41:22:
IM Andrew Greet wrote on 01/02/08 at 00:31:07:
Anyways, after 3.c3 I decided to advocate 3...d5!? for Black, leading after 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.d4 Bg7 to what is technically a variation of the Alapin in which Black has good prospects for active counterplay.



So I am curious what you do suggest against 3.Bc4 (to prevent 3... d5) followed by 4.c3 and 5.d4 ?


Yes, this is another playable option for White. Black should begin with 3...Bg7 and meet a subsequent c3 with ...e6 followed by ...d5, hitting the bishop with gain of tempo.
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #37 - 01/02/08 at 09:41:22
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IM Andrew Greet wrote on 01/02/08 at 00:31:07:
Anyways, after 3.c3 I decided to advocate 3...d5!? for Black, leading after 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.d4 Bg7 to what is technically a variation of the Alapin in which Black has good prospects for active counterplay.



So I am curious what you do suggest against 3.Bc4 (to prevent 3... d5) followed by 4.c3 and 5.d4 ?
  
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IM Andrew Greet
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #36 - 01/02/08 at 00:38:41
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flaviddude wrote on 12/30/07 at 02:21:21:
Am I right in thinking that white has to be very careful when he  does not play the Maroczy Bind and that he normally transposes into the main lines with Bc4 versus the dragon. I have games with this but cannot reveal anything as the games are in progress and will belong in
the dragon threads.  
purchase this new book on the  


Yes, you are quite right - the main difference is that in many variations Black is able to execute the central break ...d5 in one move rather than two as would be the case in the standard Dragon.
  
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IM Andrew Greet
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #35 - 01/02/08 at 00:31:07
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I see there have been a few messages pertaining to the subject of 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 g6 3.c3 and 3.d4 cxd4 4.Qxd4!? against the Hyper Accelerated Dragon. In the book I devote a single chapter to the H.A.D. in which I lay out the respective pros and cons of 2...g6 and 2...Nc6. In order to conserve space, this particular chapter is written as something of a repertoire guide, offering advice for Black to meet lines such as 3.c3 and 3.d4 cxd4 4.Qxd4, as well as showing how White can meet 3.d4 Bg7.

Anyways, after 3.c3 I decided to advocate 3...d5!? for Black, leading after 3.exd5 Qxd5 4.d4 Bg7 to what is technically a variation of the Alapin in which Black has good prospects for active counterplay. I also conclude that 4.Qxd4, while interesting, should not worry Black unduly.
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #34 - 01/02/08 at 00:19:49
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ArKheiN wrote on 11/22/07 at 08:03:00:
Hello dear Greet, as a quite experienced accelerated dragon player, I wonder if your book is deep enough on the theory, for example if you analyze seriously the lines arising after e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.c4 Nf6 6.Nc3 d6 7.Be2 Nxd4 8.Qxd4 Bg7 9.Be3 0–0 10.Qd2 Be6 11.Rc1 Qa5 12.f3 Rfc8 13.b3 a6 14.Na4 Qxd2+ 15.Kxd2 Nd7 16.g4 because from the review of Tiviakov's DVD I read:

"The Maroczy System won't answer all of your questions. For example in the big main line in the Gurgenidze you won't find anything after 16.g4 f5 17.exf5 gxf5 18.h3 Rf8 19.f4 Rad8 except 20.g5, which is likely not White's most promising continuation. Nor will you find anything after 17.gxf5 – which brought Vaganian a quick win against Ponomariov – except 17...gxf5 18.Rhg1 Kh8. But that misses the point. The small details in the theory of the Maroczy will always be changing but if Black understands his thematic plans he should be able to find adequate resources."

And I will probably play lots of 2200+, 2300 and 2400+ OTB in the future who may play that line (or others where theory is important like the Uogele) as White, so I wonder if I should buy your book or if it is really to begin to play the accelerated dragon for the club player.

PS: (My only book on the subject is the one by Silman/Donaldson which may be still sufficient for many lines)



Sorry for the delay in responding to this and other questions. Towards the end of 2007 I spent a month abroad followed by Christmas, the Hastings tournament etc...you know how it is!

The level of theoretical coverage should be enough to satisfy most players, although a Starting Out book can of course never be encyclopaedic. I have endeavoured to pay particular attention to the most popular and theoretically critical lines, such as those mentioned in the quoted message (Gurgenidze and Uogele). For instance, there are some important improvements in a game Nijboer-Tiviakov (from the critical Gurgenidze endgame), which Tiviakov somewhat surprisingly fails to mention in his DVD.

Bottom line: yes, I would like to think I have balanced the ideas-based approach of the Starting Out series with a depth  of analysis that will hopefully be enough to satisfy more experienced players, without being too theoretically dense for typical club players.
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #33 - 12/30/07 at 02:21:21
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Andrew, I have been playing the full tilt dragon and the Modern Benoni for many years.

It is well worth mentioning that white can try to lure black from the Benoni into the Maroczy Bind just like he can from the Reti.

In the World cup Kamsky played a move order which would have allowed
Shirov to have reached the accelerated dragon but avoiding The Maroczy Bind. I am thinking of playing this line from both sides of the board in correspondence play. I shall purchase this new book when it reaches Australia.

Am I right in thinking that white has to be very careful when he  does not play the Maroczy Bind and that he normally transposes into the main lines with Bc4 versus the dragon. I have games with this but cannot reveal anything as the games are in progress and will belong in
the dragon threads.   
purchase this new book on the
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #32 - 12/25/07 at 11:20:47
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TopNotch wrote on 12/20/07 at 00:05:03:
TimS wrote on 12/17/07 at 11:26:43:
FightingDragon wrote on 12/17/07 at 08:37:03:
@TopNotch: that's interesting.
My main opening with black is the regular dragon, but I use the Hyper-Acceleated occasionally, and mostly against lower-rated players.
I think that 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 g6 3.c3 is interesting, and the position after 3. ... Bg7 4.d4 cd4: 5.cd4: d5 6.e5 Bg4 is perfectly suited to play for a win against weaker opponents.
On the other hand, I don't really trust 3.d4 cd4: 4.Qd4:! for black.  Undecided

Another interesting question: how to assess 1.e4 c5 2.c3 g6 ?

*Hmm, I've just reached this position (6.e5 Bg4) against a player rated 117pts higher!
*The 4.Qd4 line is interesting but I don't think Black has too much to worry about. It's a rare bird, in my experience, and often White seems to have picked it hurriedly before a game after being told it's a refutation of of 2...g6 rather than because he has been playing it regularly and knows what's going on.
*I also play 1.e4 c5 2.c3 g6. From my viewpoint one of the attractions of playing the hyper move-order is that I can meet c3 with ...g6. Some of the lines are promising for White but again I don't think Black is in any real difficulties, but he does need to know some theory.


This sounds a lot like Dzinzi in Chess Openings for Black Explained. In your game 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 g6 3.c3 Bg7 4.d4 cd4: 5.cd4: d5 6.e5 Bg4 if White now aims to exchange his light squared bishop for your knight on b8, then that's a good sign that he understands this position well  Wink

Good luck

TN Smiley  

Yes, it is Black Explained although I was playing it before the book came out (it was a main reason for buying the book - I don't play the authors' recommendations agst 1.d4).
Also Yes, White has just played 7.Bg5+, which to be fair is what just about everyone plays, in my experience. I've seen ...Nbd7 recommended as a counter but I usually play ...Nc6 - I'll check the lines tonight before making my reply. The latter involves an interesting pawn sac in some lines, eg after ...Nh6, Qc1. I was successful with it the one time I played it OTB, albeit agst a much weaker opponent, but I want to check it thoroughly before essaying it in corr
  
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Re: Starting Out: Accelerated Dragon
Reply #31 - 12/20/07 at 03:32:18
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Such positions have concerned me since I bought Schwarz' 1980 book on the Morra Gambit because of 1.e4 c5 2.d4 cxd4 3.c3 g6 4.cxd4 (later authors have tried to stick to the gambit with 4.Nf3 Bg7 5.Bc4 but d3!) d5 5.e5 Bg7 and Schwarz gives three options:
a) 6.h3 and Black has to solve the problem of Bc8. One not random example is Haas-Rechel, Wiesbaden 1999.
b) 6.Nc3 Nc6 7.Bb5 and one game is Jonkman-Van Mil, NEDch sf 1994.
c) 6.Nf3 Bg4 7.Bb5+ Nd7!? or 7.Nc3 Nc6 8.Bb5 and of course I do not understand these positions very well, but games like Korneev-Malakhov, Elista 1995 (13.Bg5!) and Pelikian-Perelshteyn, Osasco 2004 make me doubt about White's advantage. It looks like 7.Bb5+ Nc6 8.Bxc6+ is good for White though, as (s)he can prevent ...c6-c5.

It always has been my impression, that White might try to take benefit from the knight being on g1 yet. Black has a cramped position, so Black welcomes 6.Nf3 Bg4.
Having written this, I always preferred a Panov-like position with 5.exd5. So how is 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 g6 3.c3 Bg7 4.d4 cxd4 5.cxd4 d5 6.exd5 Qxd5 doing these days? Or should Black postpone the exchange on d4 here?
  
The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
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