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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Ruy Lopez Keres Variation (Read 39936 times)
vallescure
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #20 - 01/22/15 at 11:38:33
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In this variation , sometimes White plays 12 Kh1 , which has rather good stats
But all engines prefer 12...Qc7 , after what  it seems impossible for White to get whatsoever
But in my DBs this move has never been played
Is there a hidden refutation ?
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #19 - 11/18/14 at 22:41:38
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here's a nice correspondence game with black winning
after stabilising things on the queenside, black organises a King's Indian pawn storm
of course stuff like 26.Nf1, 28.Ng3, 29.Nf1 can't be right


  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #18 - 08/21/14 at 19:22:05
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PANFR wrote on 02/19/12 at 21:29:57:
brabo wrote on 02/19/12 at 07:06:28:
To my knowledge, today white focus himself on 2 mainlines to go for an openingadvantage:
12.d5.
and the line 
12. Nbd2 exd4 13. cxd4 Nc6 14. d5 Nce5 15.a4 Rb8 16. Nxe5 Nxe5 17. axb5 axb5 18. f4 Ng6 19. Nf3 Bh4 20.Nxh4 Qxh4 21.f5 Ne5 22.Rf1 Bd7 23.Bf4 Ra8 24.Bxe5 dxe5 where recently some correspondence games were won for white from this position.


I don't believe 12.d5 should be much of a threat. Maybe 12...Nb6 has some issues, but Romanishin's 12...Nc4 looks good enough.

After 12.d5 Nb6 13.Nbd2, what about 13...Qe8, with the idea ...f5 and ...Qg6 or...Qh5? It seems this gives black good counterplay.
  
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BobbyDigital80
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #17 - 11/11/13 at 08:41:54
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Anonymous3 wrote on 10/10/13 at 22:42:00:
BobbyDigital80 wrote on 10/10/13 at 02:35:40:
If black wants to play for a win, how about 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6 5. O-O Be7 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6 8. c3 O-O 9. h3 Na5 10. Bc2 c5 11. d4 Nd7 12. Nbd2 exd4 13. cxd4 Nc6 14. d5 Nce5 15. Nxe5 Nxe5 16. f4 Ng6 17. Nf3 Bh4 18. Nxh4 Qxh4 19. Rf1 f5 20. e5 Bb7!
If white plays 21.e6 then after 21...Ne7 his d-pawn is lost. This looks like nice active play for black. His rooks can quickly come to d8 and e8 and put pressure on white's center pawns.

What about 21.Be3 with good pressure for White? What's wrong with the line I gave starting with 19...Bxh3 that seems to lead to an advantage for Black?


You're right. You gave good analysis. I like that ...Rf6!! idea that crops up in a couple lines. The Graf is a great line!
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #16 - 10/10/13 at 22:42:00
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BobbyDigital80 wrote on 10/10/13 at 02:35:40:
If black wants to play for a win, how about 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6 5. O-O Be7 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6 8. c3 O-O 9. h3 Na5 10. Bc2 c5 11. d4 Nd7 12. Nbd2 exd4 13. cxd4 Nc6 14. d5 Nce5 15. Nxe5 Nxe5 16. f4 Ng6 17. Nf3 Bh4 18. Nxh4 Qxh4 19. Rf1 f5 20. e5 Bb7!
If white plays 21.e6 then after 21...Ne7 his d-pawn is lost. This looks like nice active play for black. His rooks can quickly come to d8 and e8 and put pressure on white's center pawns.

What about 21.Be3 with good pressure for White? What's wrong with the line I gave starting with 19...Bxh3 that seems to lead to an advantage for Black?
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #15 - 10/10/13 at 02:35:40
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If black wants to play for a win, how about 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Ba4 Nf6 5. O-O Be7 6. Re1 b5 7. Bb3 d6 8. c3 O-O 9. h3 Na5 10. Bc2 c5 11. d4 Nd7 12. Nbd2 exd4 13. cxd4 Nc6 14. d5 Nce5 15. Nxe5 Nxe5 16. f4 Ng6 17. Nf3 Bh4 18. Nxh4 Qxh4 19. Rf1 f5 20. e5 Bb7!
If white plays 21.e6 then after 21...Ne7 his d-pawn is lost. This looks like nice active play for black. His rooks can quickly come to d8 and e8 and put pressure on white's center pawns.
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #14 - 10/04/13 at 04:13:36
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I notice that Panczyk and Ilczuk in a Yearbook article a couple of years ago had the same view about line C.
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #13 - 10/04/13 at 03:19:02
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Back to the original topic of this thread. Can Black soundly avoid the 3 perpetual checks Davies thought Black had to give in the Keres variation of the Ruy Lopez in his book "Play 1.e4 e5!"? I think the answer is yes!


1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 Bb5 a6 4 Ba4 Nf6 5 0-0 Be7 6 Re1 b5 7 Bb3 d6 8 c3 0-0 9 h3 Na5 10 Bc2 c5 11 d4 Nd7 12 Nbd2 exd4 13 cxd4 Nc6 14 d5 Nce5 15 Nxe5 Nxe5 and now:


A) 16 f4 Ng6 17 Nf3 Bh4 18 Nxh4 Qxh4 19 Rf1. I think White will be slightly if Black brings a rook to the e-file as Watson suggested. Davies also mentions 19....f5 20.e5! dxe5 21.fxe5 Nxe5 22.Be3 as risky for Black and I think White is slightly better. After 19...Bxh3 20.gxh3 Qg3+ 21.Kh1 Qx3+ 22.Kg1 Qg3+ 23.Kh1, I don't think Black has to take the draw and can actually gain at least a slight advantage with 23...Nh4! Here is some analysis:

A1) 24.Qe2 Qh3+ 25.Kg1 f5! (26.Qh2 Qg4+! 27.Kf2 Qf3+ 28.Kg1 Rf6! 29.exf5 Rh6! 30.Qxh4 Qxf1+ 31.Kxf1 Rxh4 =+) 26.e5 Rae8 27.Qh2 Nf3+ 28.Rxf3 Qxf3 29.Qg2 Qxg2+ (or 29...Qh5) 30.Kxg2 dxe5 ∓

A2) 24.Qd2 Qh3+ 25.Kg1 f5! 26.e5 (26.Qh2 transposes above) 26...Rae8 27.Bd1 (27.Qh2 again transposes above) 27...Rf6!! 28.exf6 Re3 -+


B) 16 f4 Ng6 17 Nf3 Bh4 18 Nxh4 Qxh4 19.e5 Ne5 20.Rf1 Bd7 21.f6 Bxh3 22 gxh3 Qg3+ 23 Kh1 Qxh3+ 24 Kg1 now Black shouldn't take the draw here and instead get a completely winning attack with 24...gxf6!, with the idea of ...Kh8 and ...Rg8.


C) 16.a4 and now if play goes 16...Rb8 17.axb5 axb5 18.f4 Ng6 19.Nf3 Bh4 20.Nxh4 Qxh4 21.Rf1 Bxh3 22.gxh3 Qg3+ 23.Kh1 Qxh3+ 24.Kg1, 24...Nh4? doesn't work here because of 25.Rf2 Ra8 26.Ra3!. I don't think Black has any sound way to avoid the draw if he plays 16...Rb8. Davies gives 16...Bb7 as an alternative to 16...Rb8 and this not only avoid the draw but may be theoretically better than 16...Rb8. 17.f4 Ng6 (Davies recommends 17...Nd7 18.Nf3 Re8 but I think white should be slightly better here) 18.Nf3 Re8. Having the knight on g6 instead of d7 makes it harder for White to play e5 as after dxe5, the Black Queen will be attack White's d-pawn.
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #12 - 02/19/12 at 21:29:57
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brabo wrote on 02/19/12 at 07:06:28:
To my knowledge, today white focus himself on 2 mainlines to go for an openingadvantage:
12.d5.
and the line 
12. Nbd2 exd4 13. cxd4 Nc6 14. d5 Nce5 15.a4 Rb8 16. Nxe5 Nxe5 17. axb5 axb5 18. f4 Ng6 19. Nf3 Bh4 20.Nxh4 Qxh4 21.f5 Ne5 22.Rf1 Bd7 23.Bf4 Ra8 24.Bxe5 dxe5 where recently some correspondence games were won for white from this position.


I don't believe 12.d5 should be much of a threat. Maybe 12...Nb6 has some issues, but Romanishin's 12...Nc4 looks good enough.
The other variation is certainly more interesting. I have seen these games with 25.b3 but I don't think they can achieve something. However, Kotronias' slightly risky plan with 25.Rxa8 Rxa8 26.d6!? may be objectively equal, but Black does have to be careful. Factly, Black (Erwin L'Ami) defended very well, but blundered badly on move 35 (35...Ra8 is more or less a forced draw).
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #11 - 02/19/12 at 07:06:28
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PANFR wrote on 02/18/12 at 14:18:29:


This is the "refutation of the refutation" of the Graf variation. Black has a great game after move 27, despite being a clear exchange down. Delchev simply blundered, and lost (apparently he completely overlook 34...dc2 35.Qh5, when Black is mated).

To my knowledge, today white focus himself on 2 mainlines to go for an openingadvantage:
12.d5.
and the line 
12. Nbd2 exd4 13. cxd4 Nc6 14. d5 Nce5 15.a4 Rb8 16. Nxe5 Nxe5 17. axb5 axb5 18. f4 Ng6 19. Nf3 Bh4 20.Nxh4 Qxh4 21.f5 Ne5 22.Rf1 Bd7 23.Bf4 Ra8 24.Bxe5 dxe5 where recently some correspondence games were won for white from this position.
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #10 - 02/19/12 at 04:31:38
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PANFR wrote on 02/18/12 at 14:18:29:


This is the "refutation of the refutation" of the Graf variation. Black has a great game after move 27, despite being a clear exchange down. Delchev simply blundered, and lost (apparently he completely overlook 34...dc2 35.Qh5, when Black is mated).



The thread 

http://www.chesspub.com/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1148061033/ ;

contains relevant information as well. I have one addition: in reply #17 in thqat thread Accolon writes

Quote:
. I wonder if black can defend with 24...Re8. Probably I`m missing something, but e.g. 25.f6-g6 26.Bg5-Rb7(!) 27.Bxg6-fxg6 28.f7+-Kxh7 29.Ra8-Rf8 30.Bxd8-Rxd8 and black is ok.
.

After Re8 25.f6 g6 26.Ra7 wins, e.g. Rb7 27.Rxb7 Bxb7 28.Qg4. 

When checking the position with engines they all claimed that 24 ... Nf6 is equal. I looked a bit at that position with the only conclusion that I had no clue how to play for a win with White despite the material advantage. I certainly would have not considered 24 ... Nf6 if the engines would not have insisted upon it.
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #9 - 02/18/12 at 14:18:29
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This is the "refutation of the refutation" of the Graf variation. Black has a great game after move 27, despite being a clear exchange down. Delchev simply blundered, and lost (apparently he completely overlook 34...dc2 35.Qh5, when Black is mated).
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #8 - 02/17/12 at 15:45:23
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Probably just nomenclature, but the Keres treatment was fundamentally different. This one should be named "The Graf (Nenashev) variation".
As far as I'm concerned, white is unable to prove some advantage in all possible continuations.
  
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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #7 - 02/06/12 at 05:22:18
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From looking at master games from 2011, I think line from the first post looks to be the critical area right now. Besides 15.Nxe5, 15.a4 and 15.Nh2 are the popular tries. I've played the Ruy as White for two years and I've never had to play against the Keres (people barely play 1...e5!), but at move 15 here it seems like the usual slight advantage that you get in the Chigorin.
  

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Re: Ruy Lopez Keres Variation
Reply #6 - 01/28/12 at 20:28:50
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I dont wan't to start new topic, so maybe we will keep discussion here. What is the most challenging line in this system nowadays?
  

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