17...cxb6 18.Bb4! Bf8 19.Qc2!? is a bit better for White because Black's best is now 19...Ne8 when 20.Be1 (White is not afraid of g4 ideas anymore) with the idea Nb4. A sample line is 20...a6 21.Nc3 a5 22.Qb3!? Nf6 (to try to play g4) 23.Bf2 Nd7 (there is nothing better) 24.Na4 Rb8 25.Qb5 and Black only waits for White to double on the c file and claim a winning position.

Yeah. I have to say, I'm pretty pleased with myself. I doubt buffos will find anything. He's been uncharacteristically quiet since he's seen my recent addition. Hopefully now he realizes that Black's kingside chances in the KID are very real, and that it's never, "very, very, simple". 

Yes, I found this game a couple of days after I came up with the idea when I was seeing if it had been played before. I was quite shocked to see 21. Qa4 instead of 21. Nc3, but it looks interesting! One idea I came up with was: 

21. Qa4 Nxe4!? 22. fxe4 f3! 23. Bd1 Bd7! 24. Nc7 (24. Nxd6 Qxd6 25. gxf3 Nf4 is also okay for Black, for instance 26. Qb3 Qh6 27. Rc2 Nh3+ 28. Kh1 Ng5 29. Qxb6 Qh3 30. Rcf2 Nxe4! 31. fxe4 g3) fxg2! 25. Rf2 Bh6!, when Black is fine. Quite a nice, precise sequence in my opinion!

i just saw it... so give me some time to see it

gewgaw wrote on 06/10/09 at 17:49:40:


The NON-sissies. 

BPaulsen, 

I really appreciate the kind words! I love the KID, and I love analyzing complicated positions even more, so it's nice to know that other people appreciate what I'm doing! 

Ametanoitos, 

Maybe, maybe not! 

I had another idea today while I was in the shower (some of my best ideas come from shampooing and conditioning!) - why let the knight stay on b5? The knight on c6, at least to me, is no big deal as long as the Black queen gets the f8 square. The knight on b5 is more annoying for sure, when it takes on a7 or jumps into c7/d6. Let's skip out on the early ...a6 lines and just play ...g4, but then kick the b5 knight back out at the appropriate moment and just continue like in all the other lines, except that there will be no annoying Nbxa7 / Nc7 business. Let's look...after:

1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.e4 d6 5.Nf3 O-O 6.Be2 e5 7.O-O Nc6 8.d5 Ne7 9.Ne1 Nd7 10.Nd3 f5 11.f3 Nf6 12.Bd2 f4 13.c5 g5 14.Rc1 Ng6 15.Nb5 Rf7 16. Ba5 b6 17. cxd6 cxd6 18. Be1 g4 19. Nb4 a6!? 20. Nc6 (20. Nc3 is possible of course, but after 20...g3, I see nothing better for White than 21. Nc6 Qf8, transposing) Qf8 21. Nc3 g3 and now: 

22. h3? Nh4! 23. Na4 (a lot of other moves allow 23...Bxh3! 24. gxh3 Qc8-+) Bh8!? (23...Rb7!? might be better, but 23...Bh8 seems more in the KID spirit!) 24. Nxb6 Nxg2! 25. Nxc8 Ne3 26. N8e7+ Rxe7 27. Nxe7+ Qxe7 28. Qa4 Qa7!? with a complicated position with chances for both sides. I might take Black. 

22. Na4 Rb7!? when one possible line is 23. hxg3 fxg3 24. Bxg3 Bh6 25. Rc2 Qg7! 26. Bd3 Nh5 27. Bf2 Ngf4 28. g4 Nf6 followed by something smacking on g4. 

22. Bd3 Nh5!? (22...Bh6 is probably also playable) and now:

23. h3 Nh4! (Black wants to play ...Bxh3 followed by ...Qc8 again, so White needs to move a knight off the c-file to defend) 24. Na4 Rb7!?  (Black threatens ...b5, kicking the knight back on to the c-file) 25. b4 b5 26. Nb2 Bxh3!! (Anyway! The follow up his harder this time!) 27. gxh3 Qf7!! (the queen goes to d7, then h3) 28. Rc2 Qd7 29. Rg2 Qxh3 30. Qe2 h5! with the idea of Nh7-g5, gives Black a raging attack!

23. Ne2 gxh2+ 24. Kxg2 Ng3! 25. Nxg3 fxg3+ 26. Bxg3 Bh6 27. Rc2 Be3->

23. Na4 gxh2+ 24. Kxh2 Rb7 is once again okay for Black

23. Rc2 Bf6 24. h3 Nh4 25. Na4 Bd8 looks better for Black to me.

TonyRo wrote on 06/09/09 at 19:45:06:


I have nothing to add, but I'd like to say that thanks largely to your work (and the work of some others) this has turned into one of the most fascinating discussions I've seen on this forum next to the extremely long one in the French area.

There might not be a deeper KID variation than this one.

Even if this line emerged as += it would be incredibly hard to conduct the white pieces in practice, a task for a great technician (ie: Kramnik).