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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Grunfeld Slav (Read 21411 times)
Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #15 - 09/26/12 at 04:43:35
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Kramnik has recently played the Exchange Slav with success. Perhaps you could use some of his ideas?
  
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BPaulsen
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #14 - 07/08/12 at 02:54:14
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On the 5.cxd5 cxd5 6.Bf4 note: I was unable to find anything for white while writing "Play 1.Nf3!". I ended up investigating other paths.
  

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TN
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #13 - 07/08/12 at 02:40:52
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A brutal game, but if White plays 9.Rc1 then he obtains a slight advantage. 

I was just thinking about the transposition from a Chebanenko to a Schlechter Slav myself, but with the move order 1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 3.Nf3 Nf6 4.Nc3 a6 5.e3 g6 or 5.a4 g6. Your move order is even better, of course.  Wink
  

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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #12 - 07/07/12 at 22:10:41
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Btw, if you are playing someone who is beholden to the Avrukh repertoire, there's a nice move order you could employ.

Avrukh recommends Be2 against the Schlechter-Slav, and Bd3 against the Chebanenko move order (4...a6). 

So, if you know your opponent only plays Avrukh's lines, you could play 1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 3.Nf3 Nf6 4.e3 a6! 5.Bd3 g6!

Avrukh doesn't even mention that position!

He implies that Black is equal after 4.e3 g6 5.Bd3, but for other reasons. 

  
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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #11 - 07/07/12 at 21:51:22
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TN, do you have the complete game score?  I'm not familiar with this game.

And yes, years later let me correct that I meant "dark squared Bishop". Thanks for pointing out the error, Antillian!

I'm not sure that the reason GMs don't play g6 more is that they dislike the positions, rather that there are other, more active continuations. 

This is fine with me because it means that White doesn't tend to study it as much. I've scored quite well in OTB games. The few times I've tried it in correspondence, I've drawn. Tho some of those games haven't been as comfortable as I'd like.
  
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TN
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #10 - 07/07/12 at 06:42:01
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Sorry to bump this old thread, but it's not clear if 5.cxd5 cxd5 6.Bf4 is as good for White as previously thought. In a recent game in Chess Informant (Banikas-Skembris), Skembris thinks Black is okay after 6...Nc6 7.h3 Bg7 8.e3 0-0 9.Bd3 Qb6 10.a3 Na5, soon followed by ...Bd7 and bringing a rook to c8. Meanwhile there was a recent game, Le-Yu, where Black played 6...Bg7 7.e3 0-0 8.h3 Ne4 and went on to win. 

Perhaps 5.Bf4 Bg7 6.e3, delaying or even avoiding the exchange on d5, is a more accurate route to an edge?

Edit: ECO thinks Black is equal after 6...0-0 so maybe 5.Bg5 is a better option. I would think that trying to avoid a Grunfeld with 5...dxc4 gives White a better version of the Main Line Slav after 6.a4 Bf5 7.e3.
  

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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #9 - 09/27/08 at 12:12:49
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Hmm, according to my database, it's the other way around; even if we don't count 5.cxd5 cxd5 6.Bf4, 5.Bf4 is still more popular than 5.e3, being increasinly popular as the ELO increases, and it scores better than 5.e3. However, almost all White continuations score very well.
  
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #8 - 09/11/08 at 23:37:57
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 09/11/08 at 13:40:53:
Actually, Black usually abstains from g6 until White has committed to e3. The move order is quite important because both theory and practice have shown that White is fine if Black plays g6 while White can still develop his light squared bishop outside the pawn chain.

However, once e3 is played, the g6 Slav has proven to be an excellent, if slightly stodgy defensive weapon for Black.

Being slightly stodgy myself, I really like the Schlechter Slav against an early e3.


e3 is the most common move even when the bishop can move outside the pawn chain. For example, after

1. d4 d5 2. c4 c6 3. Nc3 Nf6 4. Nf3 g6, 5. e3 is most common and played more often as the ELO increases. It probably has something to do with dxc4 - although cxd5 prevents this idea. Thus, even in the e3 variations GMs don't like Black so much. I'm not sure why.
  
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #7 - 09/11/08 at 17:19:14
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 09/11/08 at 13:40:53:
Actually, Black usually abstains from g6 until White has committed to e3. The move order is quite important because both theory and practice have shown that White is fine if Black plays g6 while White can still develop his light squared bishop outside the pawn chain.

However, once e3 is played, the g6 Slav has proven to be an excellent, if slightly stodgy defensive weapon for Black.

Being slightly stodgy myself, I really like the Schlechter Slav against an early e3.


Dark-squared bishop is what u probably meant to say, correct?
  

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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #6 - 09/11/08 at 13:40:53
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Actually, Black usually abstains from g6 until White has committed to e3. The move order is quite important because both theory and practice have shown that White is fine if Black plays g6 while White can still develop his light squared bishop outside the pawn chain.

However, once e3 is played, the g6 Slav has proven to be an excellent, if slightly stodgy defensive weapon for Black.

Being slightly stodgy myself, I really like the Schlechter Slav against an early e3.
  
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #5 - 09/10/08 at 00:45:18
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MNb wrote on 09/09/08 at 23:41:54:
1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 3.Nf3 Nf6 4.Nc3 g6 does not have a good reputation. White has had excellent results with both 5.cxd5 cxd6 5.Bf4 and 5.Bf4.


The position after 5.Bf4 Bg7 6.e3 (played 90% of the time) 0-0 is Uhlmann's line against the Bf4 Grunfeld. Davies  Though, yes, White does score well from that position -- 63% or so.

The more interesting case is 5.cd cd 6.Bf4. White scores ~66% from that position. But I think Black has a move that, according to my database, has never been tried: 6...Ne4! 

The point is to transpose into a Grunfeld-like line of the Slav Exchange, one played by Ivan Sokolov among others. After 7.e3 Nxc3 8.bxc3 Nc6 White scores 53% from about 300 games.
  
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MNb
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #4 - 09/09/08 at 23:41:54
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1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 3.Nf3 Nf6 4.Nc3 g6 does not have a good reputation. White has had excellent results with both 5.cxd5 cxd6 5.Bf4 and 5.Bf4.
  

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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #3 - 09/09/08 at 13:03:27
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Yes, that is the other name for it.
  
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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #2 - 09/09/08 at 12:06:14
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This is called the "Schlechter Variation," is it not?  If I'm not mistaken it usually arises from 1.d4 d5 2.c4 c6 3.Nf3 Nf6 4.e3 and sooner or later ...g6.  Or did you mean a similar system with White's QB out?
  

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Re: Grunfeld Slav
Reply #1 - 09/09/08 at 07:26:00
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You can see some introduction to it here:

http://www.chessville.com/Keene/AllPurposeBlackDefence.htm
  

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