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Question: Who will win Wijk aan Zee?


* This poll has now closed *
Carlsen 22 (44.9%) Anand 4 (8.2%) Kramnik 9 (18.4%) Ivanchuk 4 (8.2%) Leko 1 (2.0%) Shirov 1 (2.0%) Karjakin 2 (4.1%) Dominguez 0 (0.0%) Nakamura 5 (10.2%) Other 1 (2.0%) Total votes: 49 « Last Modified by: OstapBender on: 01/19/10 at 20:02:31 »

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2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll (Read 63210 times)

MNb God Member Offline Rudolf Spielmann forever Posts: 10777 Location: Moengo Joined: 01/05/04 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #131 - 01/26/10 at 10:21:01	Post Tools	Print Post
	Alias wrote on 01/26/10 at 09:06:40: But haven't you called the king's indian incorrect, or something similar, Smyslov_Fan? That has a better reputation than any variation of the dutch. Timman said something like that more than 20 years ago. He might have changes his mind since then of course.

	The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged. GC Lichtenberg
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Stigma God Member Offline There is a crack in everything. Posts: 3277 Joined: 11/07/06 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #130 - 01/26/10 at 10:05:53	Post Tools	Print Post
	Keano wrote on 01/26/10 at 08:54:22: The old Petrosian joke: 'If your opponent wants to play the Dutch Defence, you shouldn't prevent him!' might still have a grain of truth to it. Personally I think the stonewall could be sounder that the Leningrad, especially it the White Knight is committed to f3. Actually, Kramnik was asked in that press conference if he hadn't played the Dutch himself, and he replied (roughly) "Yes, but that was mostly the Stonewall, and it is even worse than the Leningrad! I played around five games with it, all draws, and then gave it up."

	Improvement begins at the edge of your comfort zone. -Jonathan Rowson
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Alias God Member Offline Posts: 1512 Location: East of the river Svartån Joined: 11/19/04	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #129 - 01/26/10 at 09:06:40	Post Tools	Print Post
	Smyslov_Fan wrote on 01/25/10 at 14:18:31: While I agree with Kramnik about the Dutch, if I were to express such an opinion in a Dutch thread, I would get cut to shreds. I'm pleased to see the general audience here seems willing to agree with him. But haven't you called the king's indian incorrect, or something similar, Smyslov_Fan? That has a better reputation than any variation of the dutch.

	Don't check me with no lightweight stuff.
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Keano God Member Offline Money doesn't talk, it swears. Posts: 2928 Location: Toulouse Joined: 05/25/05 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #128 - 01/26/10 at 08:54:22	Post Tools	Print Post
	The old Petrosian joke: 'If your opponent wants to play the Dutch Defence, you shouldn't prevent him!' might still have a grain of truth to it. Personally I think the stonewall could be sounder that the Leningrad, especially it the White Knight is committed to f3.


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Schaakhamster God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 650 Joined: 05/13/08	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #127 - 01/25/10 at 21:06:58	Post Tools	Print Post
	OstapBender wrote on 01/25/10 at 20:40:10: Smyslov_Fan wrote on 01/24/10 at 21:38:26: I found [Kramnik's] comment about the Dutch more interesting though. He said that the *Dutch should not equalise*! That's pretty strong words coming from perhaps the preeminent opening theoretician in the world! I amused that he said this having played the Pirc a few rounds earlier. Maybe the Dutch has a weaker reputation, but the Pirc also seems pretty rare at the highest levels. Maybe Kramnik's comment was intended, at least in part, to be a bit self mocking. I don't think so. Kramnik chose the Pirc as a surprise-weapon to get his weaker opponent thinking on his own and to unbalance the game from the opening. Nakamura wielding the Dutch isn't a big surprise so Kramnik just took advantage of that.


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Mudhen YaBB Newbies Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 1 Joined: 01/25/10	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #126 - 01/25/10 at 20:50:29	Post Tools	Print Post
	[quote author=766C677A7B7C6D150 link=1263481129/124#124 date=1264447587]I think Nakamura should have played the dutch leningrad variation recommended by Kindermann, then kramnik wouldn't have gotten such an easy play as white Perhaps, but I recall when in a post mortem with a strong master I sugested I could have tried a different idea to which he responded: "You play differently, you lose differently."


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OstapBender God Member Offline There is no spoon. Posts: 1491 Location: not in Kansas anymore Joined: 10/16/04	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #125 - 01/25/10 at 20:40:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	Smyslov_Fan wrote on 01/24/10 at 21:38:26: I found [Kramnik's] comment about the Dutch more interesting though. He said that the *Dutch should not equalise*! That's pretty strong words coming from perhaps the preeminent opening theoretician in the world! I amused that he said this having played the Pirc a few rounds earlier. Maybe the Dutch has a weaker reputation, but the Pirc also seems pretty rare at the highest levels. Maybe Kramnik's comment was intended, at least in part, to be a bit self mocking.

	"If God had wanted us to vote, he would have given us candidates." -Jay Leno
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battleangel Ex Member	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #124 - 01/25/10 at 19:26:27	Post Tools	Print Post
	I think Nakamura should have played the dutch leningrad variation recommended by Kindermann, then kramnik wouldn't have gotten such an easy play as white Smyslov_Fan wrote on 01/24/10 at 21:38:26: Btw, Kramnik, after his game against Nakamura, stated that he "was probably lucky yesterday". He also said that Nakamura has a good chance to become world champion... if "we" all gave up! He then said he was joking and that Nakamura has improved greatly over the last year and will probably break the top ten. I found his comment about the Dutch more interesting though. He said that the *Dutch should not equalise*! That's pretty strong words coming from perhaps the preeminent opening theoretician in the world!


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Smyslov_Fan God Member Correspondence fan Offline Progress depends on the unreasonable man. ~GBS Posts: 6902 Joined: 06/15/05	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #123 - 01/25/10 at 16:15:54	Post Tools	Print Post
	Actually, Kramnik joked that the bookstore was closed, so he had to work out what to do against 8..Ne4 on his own. He finally figured out that he doesn't take the N and gets an advantage!


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Göran Senior Member Offline ChessPublishing is great! Posts: 454 Location: Sweden Joined: 02/13/08 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #122 - 01/25/10 at 15:17:00	Post Tools	Print Post
	...or it could be that we only are nice people plying Dutch. The great Chigorin said: "Often "theoretical" is a synonyme for routine. Because that which is "theoretical" in chess is nothing other than what can be found in books, and which players endeavour to adhere to when they cannot devise anything stronger, or equally good and more original." I guess that Kramnik also found an old book on Dutch Defence in the very same bookshop.

	What kind of proof is that?
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Smyslov_Fan God Member Correspondence fan Offline Progress depends on the unreasonable man. ~GBS Posts: 6902 Joined: 06/15/05	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #121 - 01/25/10 at 14:18:31	Post Tools	Print Post
	While I agree with Kramnik about the Dutch, if I were to express such an opinion in a Dutch thread, I would get cut to shreds. I'm pleased to see the general audience here seems willing to agree with him.


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Göran Senior Member Offline ChessPublishing is great! Posts: 454 Location: Sweden Joined: 02/13/08 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #120 - 01/25/10 at 13:21:55	Post Tools	Print Post
	Yeh, state of mind is often as important as state of theory and not quite seldom even more.

	What kind of proof is that?
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Antillian God Member Offline Brilliance without dazzle! Posts: 1757 Joined: 01/05/03 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #119 - 01/25/10 at 12:11:30	Post Tools	Print Post
	I don't find the comment surprising either. Wasn't Petrosian famous for similar comments about the King's Indian? I would add, I think it is exactly the right attitude a 1.d4 player must have. A true 1.d4 player must have a certain level of contempt for openings like the Dutch.

	"Breakthrough results come about by a series of good decisions, diligently executed and accumulated one on top of another." Jim Collins --- Good to Great
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Schaakhamster God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 650 Joined: 05/13/08	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #118 - 01/25/10 at 09:31:23	Post Tools	Print Post
	BPaulsen wrote on 01/24/10 at 22:10:36: Smyslov_Fan wrote on 01/24/10 at 21:38:26: Btw, Kramnik, after his game against Nakamura, stated that he "was probably lucky yesterday". He also said that Nakamura has a good chance to become world champion... if "we" all gave up! He then said he was joking and that Nakamura has improved greatly over the last year and will probably break the top ten. I found his comment about the Dutch more interesting though. He said that the *Dutch should not equalise! That's pretty strong words coming from perhaps the preeminent opening theoretician in the world! This reminds me of a comment Aronian made in a game he annotated, when discussing Kramnik's novelty in the Meran. Aronian's comment from Aronian-Grischuk, Sochi 2008 Quote:* Given that the greatest theoretician of our galaxy, Kramnik, recently played 13. Nd2 here the text must be considered old-fashioned Pretty remarkable for a player of Kramnik's stature to make such a comment about an entire opening (the Dutch). I f he would have said it about the Slav or something, it would have been shocking. But I think he wouldn't be alone in considering the Dutch a bit dubious. But does it matter really for 99,99% of the chessplayers if one of the strongest players of the moment considers it not fit for elite-chess?


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TalJechin God Member Offline There is no secret ingredient. Posts: 2892 Location: Malmö Joined: 08/12/04 Gender:	Re: 2010 Wijk aan Zee, Group A Poll Reply #117 - 01/25/10 at 08:12:40	Post Tools	Print Post
	He probably just meant that it's hard to force a draw in the Dutch!


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