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C44: Play the Ponziani book (Read 12265 times)

Smyslov_Fan YaBB Moderator Correspondence fan Offline Progress depends on the unreasonable man. ~GBS Posts: 6902 Joined: 06/15/05	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #63 - 11/26/12 at 21:29:53	Post Tools	Print Post
	I'm bumping this because David Taylor, the author of a Ponziani book, is starting a new thread on the topic!


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STEFANOS Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 71 Joined: 03/27/08	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #62 - 02/24/12 at 07:48:39	Post Tools	Print Post
	The Steinitz variation 4...f6 is good but also gives and white chances to fight, I attached a link to a game I played as white using the Ponziani and I met 4...f6 http://www.chesscafe.com/text/lane54.pdf , for me the most challenging way is 4...Bd7. I do not believe Ponziani has been refuted, if someones speaks for 4.Bb5 yes this line is completely busted , but 4.Qa4 is just fine and nobody has given any clear refutation.


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SWJediknight God Member Offline Alert... opponent out of book! Posts: 916 Joined: 03/14/08	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #61 - 02/22/12 at 20:16:04	Post Tools	Print Post
	micawber wrote on 02/22/12 at 16:59:41: Quote: I believe Alekhine and Chigorin played this move (4 ...f6) so it does have some chess pedigree behind it and is not just a recent digital addition to theory. Actually i dont think Chigorin played this line, and Aljechin only once in his youth (1902....and lost). However the first game in this line was played in 1869 by the first World Champion W.Steinitz. While we have several games by Pillsbury and also one by Capablanca. Between 1914 and 1980 the line apparently out of fashion, but since 1980 it has been employed on a regular basis. The line also featured in Emms repertoire book (2000). Emms recommended 4.Qa4 Bd7- are you thinking of one of the other 1.e4 e5 books?


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micawber God Member Offline like many sneaks and skunks in history he's a poet Posts: 852 Location: Netherlands Joined: 09/07/05 Gender:	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #60 - 02/22/12 at 17:58:12	Post Tools	Print Post
	You are right, I only considered 5.Bb5,Nge7 6.cxd5,Qxd5....


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barnaby Senior Member Offline The night is dark and full of terrors. Posts: 345 Joined: 01/09/12 Gender:	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #59 - 02/22/12 at 17:40:57	Post Tools	Print Post
	I have two games in my database that suggest he may have: Baird-Chigorin and Utkin-Chigorin...both Black wins from 1889. Baird played d3 and Utkin essayed Bb5.


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micawber God Member Offline like many sneaks and skunks in history he's a poet Posts: 852 Location: Netherlands Joined: 09/07/05 Gender:	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #58 - 02/22/12 at 16:59:41	Post Tools	Print Post
	Quote: I believe Alekhine and Chigorin played this move (4 ...f6) so it does have some chess pedigree behind it and is not just a recent digital addition to theory. Actually i dont think Chigorin played this line, and Aljechin only once in his youth (1902....and lost). However the first game in this line was played in 1869 by the first World Champion W.Steinitz. While we have several games by Pillsbury and also one by Capablanca. Between 1914 and 1980 the line apparently out of fashion, but since 1980 it has been employed on a regular basis. The line also featured in Emms repertoire book (2000).


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Jonathan Tait God Member Offline Posts: 617 Location: Nottingham Joined: 07/11/06	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #57 - 02/21/12 at 15:29:47	Post Tools	Print Post
	PANFR wrote on 02/20/12 at 18:27:38: Kaufmann in his new repertoire book advocates 3...d5 4.Qa4 f6, but personally I would take any of his suggestions rather lightly- they come out of silicon logic, not chessic experience. That said, I believe 4...f6 is adequate. I've always played that line. I think I got it from an old book by Zagorovsky: Romantic Chess Openings.

	blog inspired by Bronstein's book, but using my own games: http://200opengames.blogspot.co.uk/
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barnaby Senior Member Offline The night is dark and full of terrors. Posts: 345 Joined: 01/09/12 Gender:	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #56 - 02/20/12 at 20:16:44	Post Tools	Print Post
	I believe Alekhine and Chigorin played this move (4 ...f6) so it does have some chess pedigree behind it and is not just a recent digital addition to theory.


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PANFR Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 256 Location: Greece Joined: 10/31/11 Gender:	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #55 - 02/20/12 at 18:27:38	Post Tools	Print Post
	Kaufmann in his new repertoire book advocates 3...d5 4.Qa4 f6, but personally I would take any of his suggestions rather lightly- they come out of silicon logic, not chessic experience. That said, I believe 4...f6 is adequate.


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STEFANOS Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 71 Joined: 03/27/08	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #54 - 09/19/11 at 21:35:31	Post Tools	Print Post
	drawyah wrote on 09/19/11 at 03:00:55: Ender wrote on 09/04/11 at 18:42:10: Gustaffson gives line for equality, but Kauffman's in in my opinion more dangerous. I analysed it, and cannot find any real way for white. That's why i wanted to know if someone who have this book can gice some hints. I don't want to waste money if he didnt find anything new. 14 Na3 from this game is the key improvement to Kaufmann's 2004 analysis. I recently saw Kaufmann book is being update, so maybe he will have a counter-improvement? Good Chess! Keith [Event "Pan American tt9 B4 corr"] [Site "ICCF email"] [Date "2007.04.15"] [White "Schakel, Corky"] [Black "Akwei, Loving"] [Result "1-0"] [ECO "C44"] [WhiteElo "2391"] [BlackElo "2322"] [WhiteTeam "United States"] [BlackTeam "Canada"] 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 c3 d5 4 Qa4 Bd7 5 exd5 Nd4 6 Qd1 Nxf3+ 7 Qxf3 Nf6 8 Bc4 e4 9 Qe2 Bd6 10 d4 O-O 11 Bg5 h6 12 Bh4 Re8 13 O-O Bf4 14 Na3 a6 15 Bb3 b5 16 Rfe1 Rb8 17 c4 c6 18 dxc6 Bxc6 19 Rad1 bxc4 20 Nxc4 Bb5 21 d5 a5 22 Qc2 Bxh2+ 23 Kxh2 Ng4+ 24 Kg3 1-0 ok, after 22.Qc2 white has an edge according to the computer, but even without a computer it is very easy to see that the Greek gift is really unsound, even a possible time trouble is not a good excuse. All in all 14.Na3 is very interesting.Rybka opening book has the position till 19.Rad1 and says white has the advantage ( I do not know why from the 15. till 19 lots of moves have ?! they are doubtful, really do not know, possibly the book is not so good as they advertise). Houdini prefers the move 17.Nc2 with the idea Ne3 and Bc2 to follow.


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Ender Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 408 Joined: 05/22/06	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #53 - 09/19/11 at 08:57:24	Post Tools	Print Post
	This Na3 looks interesting! Ill check it and post my analysis here.

	2200. Amateur!
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drawyah YaBB Newbies Offline Posts: 20 Location: Corinth Joined: 08/19/05 Gender:	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #52 - 09/19/11 at 03:00:55	Post Tools	Print Post
	Ender wrote on 09/04/11 at 18:42:10: Gustaffson gives line for equality, but Kauffman's in in my opinion more dangerous. I analysed it, and cannot find any real way for white. That's why i wanted to know if someone who have this book can gice some hints. I don't want to waste money if he didnt find anything new. 14 Na3 from this game is the key improvement to Kaufmann's 2004 analysis. I recently saw Kaufmann book is being update, so maybe he will have a counter-improvement? Good Chess! Keith [Event "Pan American tt9 B4 corr"] [Site "ICCF email"] [Date "2007.04.15"] [White "Schakel, Corky"] [Black "Akwei, Loving"] [Result "1-0"] [ECO "C44"] [WhiteElo "2391"] [BlackElo "2322"] [WhiteTeam "United States"] [BlackTeam "Canada"] 1 e4 e5 2 Nf3 Nc6 3 c3 d5 4 Qa4 Bd7 5 exd5 Nd4 6 Qd1 Nxf3+ 7 Qxf3 Nf6 8 Bc4 e4 9 Qe2 Bd6 10 d4 O-O 11 Bg5 h6 12 Bh4 Re8 13 O-O Bf4 14 Na3 a6 15 Bb3 b5 16 Rfe1 Rb8 17 c4 c6 18 dxc6 Bxc6 19 Rad1 bxc4 20 Nxc4 Bb5 21 d5 a5 22 Qc2 Bxh2+ 23 Kxh2 Ng4+ 24 Kg3 1-0


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Ender Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 408 Joined: 05/22/06	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #51 - 09/04/11 at 18:42:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	Gustaffson gives line for equality, but Kauffman's in in my opinion more dangerous. I analysed it, and cannot find any real way for white. That's why i wanted to know if someone who have this book can gice some hints. I don't want to waste money if he didnt find anything new.

	2200. Amateur!
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kylemeister God Member Offline Posts: 4989 Location: USA Joined: 10/24/05	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #50 - 09/04/11 at 18:22:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	I don't know what Gustafsson's almost-refutation is, but regarding Kaufman's almost-refutation (he had some verbiage to that effect), one thing I noticed (and mentioned here about three years ago) was that he didn't say anything about the (quite decent-looking) way Albin Planin(e)c played in a game against Mariotti in 1970.


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Ametanoitos God Member Offline The road to success is under construction Posts: 1429 Location: Patras Joined: 01/04/05	Re: C44: Play the Ponziani book Reply #49 - 09/04/11 at 17:16:30	Post Tools	Print Post
	I'd be more worried about Gusti's suggestions in his DVD to combat the Ponziani. His proposal looks almost as a refutation


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