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Normal Topic Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary? (Read 4681 times)
Dink Heckler
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #9 - 03/01/11 at 10:49:48
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Thanks, guys, I will check out these books...the Closed Openings are a major hole in my chess education....too many Danish / Goring Gambits as a kid....misspent youth indeed...
  
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MNb
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #8 - 03/01/11 at 00:59:17
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Markovich wrote on 02/28/11 at 15:47:35:
I don't understand how MNb can say that the Acc. Drag. leads to fairly open positions as well.

How would you call the position after 1.e4 c5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.d4 cxd4 4.Nxd4 g6 5.Nc3 Bg7 6.Be3 Nf6 then?
I don't see pawn chains, I see quick piece development, I see a lot of tactics coming (OK, I know this because I have played through a lot of games). To me the position looks more open than the Closed Italian or the Closed Ruy Lopez. The main difference between this line and open positions from the Open games is that Black has hold back the d- and e-pawns, but that's by far not enough to call this a not-open position imo.
Also note that the OP plays 1.e4 e5 as White.
  
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #7 - 02/28/11 at 22:48:15
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I have this German book by the Dutch publisher Variant. It's an absolute masterpiece. Maybe even my favourite chess book of all time.
I would prefer it to every other "classic" games collection by a grand master. The main points are that Keres explains in detail and with only few variations (mostly when the action on the board makes an analysis tree inevitable) and strives for objectivity even if it makes his own play look weaker. This wasn't the norm back then.

A (very brief) comparison with the two Keres/Nunn books shows that there is a lot of overlapping content (100 games until 1958), but the German book seems to have even more detailed verbal explanations. The biographical prose seemed to be identical. Of course I can't claim that this is true, but it was the impression I had.


Reg. the original question:
Stick to the Acc. Dragon if it works for you. I'm sure there are more urgent things to improve than your knowledge about 1. - e5.
  
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #6 - 02/28/11 at 18:56:42
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http://www.amazon.com/PAUL-KERES-Vols-QUEST-PERFECTION/dp/B000VZWYIU/ref=tag_dpp...

Edited by Nunn and in algebraic format.   

  
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Dink Heckler
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #5 - 02/28/11 at 16:22:38
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Guys, for the bibliographically-challenged, which Keres book(s) are we talking about, please?
  
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Markovich
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #4 - 02/28/11 at 15:47:35
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I fully agree with the OP that Keres' selected games are a great education in how to play open positions (which of course don't always arise from 1...e5).  The depth of commentary is neither too heavy nor too light, but certainly is detailed enough.  And yes, Keres does talk about what he was thinking during these games.

If anybody has the original, 3-volume hardback edition, I would pay good money for it. 

@Highfive: Kf you're under 2100 or so and you want to improve, I would encourage you to take up 1...e5.  I don't understand how MNb can say that the Acc. Drag. leads to fairly open positions as well.
  
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TN
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #3 - 02/28/11 at 13:13:33
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If the Accelerated Dragon is your golden fleece, then don't learn other systems against 1.e4 just yet.

However, you could definitely learn a lot from the 1.e4 e5 games of the old masters. Regarding Keres's book, does Keres give insights into his thoughts during the game, why he selected or rejected certain moves, and how detailed are the verbal explanations? Chernev's 'Logical Chess Move by Move' and 'My Great Predecessors' also serve a similarly useful purpose. 

  
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MartinC
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #2 - 02/28/11 at 10:43:03
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Well the reason for it is to develop your tactics by forcing you to play that sort of open position. But if you're doing that as white anyway then can't see it as a truly major problem.

And anyway assume you're playing mostly for fun Smiley 

Of course if you're interested then by all means develop it as a secondary weapon as black. Playing the same thing for years on end can get dull rather easily and/or rather easier to prepare for than you'd strictly prefer.
  
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MNb
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Re: Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
Reply #1 - 02/28/11 at 10:38:53
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You might be the exception confirming the rule.
Nah, the Accelerated Dragon leads to fairly open positions as well. The usual objection is the Maroczy Wall, but if you don't have problems with that I don't see any reason to give it up. Moreover you have played 1.e4 e5 as White, so you already have benefited from it for your development.
Key to improvement is working on your weaknesses. So it seems to me a waste of time to switch to 1...e5 and work out a detailed defence based on this move. A few glances and some analysis never hurts of course; you might switch in the future, when you are not satisfied with the Acc. Dragon anymore for some reason or another.
But your main focus should be on other aspects I opine - at least for the time being.
  
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Learning 1....e5 is it really neccesary?
02/28/11 at 09:48:47
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Hi,

I am a uscf class A player and have been playing the accelerated dragon regularly for the past 2 years.   I looked over my database of games recently and I score best with my chosen defence to 1.e4, even considerably better then when I am playing white.   

But recently I went over Paul Keres' annotated collection and have been amazed by the interesting games he played in double king pawn openings.  And I've also been hearing from multiple sources that playing them is very helpful for one's development as a chess player.   I have been playing double king pawn openings on the white side, but am now considering learning/playing 1...e5 as well.  I would love to hear people's thoughts on this, as I feel a little conflicted since on the one hand I already have an acceptable defense to 1.e4 that has been scoring fairly well, and also 1...e5 is an intensely theoretical opening.   

  
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