Latest Updates:
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 5
Topic Tools
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Breyer (Read 60991 times)
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #62 - 04/02/12 at 03:13:24
Post Tools
I think it might have been that line, I remember reading about it in a NIC Yearbook.
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TN
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 3420
Joined: 11/07/08
Gender: Male
Re: Breyer
Reply #61 - 04/01/12 at 23:26:48
Post Tools
16.Bh4 has only been played in one game, but it looks like a line that could be successful in a one-off game, since the obvious lines with ...g5 at some point give White at least full compensation for the pawn. However if Black ignores this temptation and plays in the centre then he has a slightly better version of a normal Breyer: 16...c5 17.Qd2 ed4N 18.cd4 cd4 19.Nd4 Rc8 20.a4 and the position is fairly typical but for White's h4-bishop which is not doing anything. That said the position looks equal.

Did you mean the 15.b3 d5 16.Bg5 variation?
  

All our dreams come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #60 - 04/01/12 at 20:21:07
Post Tools
What is the status of the knight sacrifice line, I think after 15. Bg5 h6 16. Bh4 g5 17. Nxg5?
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #59 - 03/25/12 at 00:19:02
Post Tools
TN wrote on 03/24/12 at 13:15:21:
Is it worth watching Ronen's series if I already have Kaufman's book?


Yes, I have an ICC account and I watched the five-video series. It is quite instructive since plans and tactics are given as well. I cannot remember the exact duration of the videos, but I think it was around 20 minutes or so each.

Regarding books on the Breyer, I also asked about this but apparently there are not many books. The only books I have on the Breyer are my old New In Chess Yearbooks. I wish Quality Chess, Chess Stars, or Everyman (or all of those publishing houses) would publish either an objective coverage/overview book or a repertoire book on the Breyer. With Grandmaster Repertoire series by Quality Chess, the Breyer would be an interesting choice for that series. A high-calibre Breyer repertoire book that is 300 pages long would be excellent.
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
LeeRoth
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 1520
Joined: 10/22/05
Re: Breyer
Reply #58 - 03/24/12 at 14:05:48
Post Tools
TN wrote on 03/24/12 at 13:15:21:
Are there any books other than Kaufman with model games in the Breyer from Black's point of view? I've found it easy to find theory on the 15.b3 variation, but there's not much coverage on other lines in the sources I have.

Is it worth watching Ronen's series if I already have Kaufman's book?

In another thread I saw a member complaining that the 15.a4 c5 16.d5 c4 variation was too easy for White to play. I prefer 15...Bg7 16.Bd3 d5, as played successfully in Shirov-Mamedyarov, Tal Memorial 2010.


17.Bg5 b4 and now Shirov's 18.cxb4 may not have been best.  In subsequent games, White's played 18.c4 and 18.Qc2 and there's also Marin's suggestion of 18.Qb3 to think about.




  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TN
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 3420
Joined: 11/07/08
Gender: Male
Re: Breyer
Reply #57 - 03/24/12 at 13:15:21
Post Tools
Are there any books other than Kaufman with model games in the Breyer from Black's point of view? I've found it easy to find theory on the 15.b3 variation, but there's not much coverage on other lines in the sources I have.

Is it worth watching Ronen's series if I already have Kaufman's book?

In another thread I saw a member complaining that the 15.a4 c5 16.d5 c4 variation was too easy for White to play. I prefer 15...Bg7 16.Bd3 d5, as played successfully in Shirov-Mamedyarov, Tal Memorial 2010.
  

All our dreams come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #56 - 03/14/12 at 23:17:15
Post Tools
Looking at my copies of previous New In Chess Yearbooks, I found Yearbook no. 82, pp. 123-130, where the survey focusses on 15. b3 d5. I suppose these are the lines that require specific study instead of just reviewing plans. Looking at all the analyses and the other Yearbook articles on the Breyer, the material could easily constitute that of a small book.
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ANDREW BRETT
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 622
Joined: 07/07/06
Re: Breyer
Reply #55 - 03/14/12 at 10:30:05
Post Tools
Breyer is good enough for a win-

Pentala Harikrishna seems to do very well with it.

Its advantages are that engines cannot refute it. Even white's best tries don't lead to a huge disadvantage.

Blackstock's book was very good and still is good today albeit the a4, bd3 lines hadn't been developed then and the b3 line being met by d5 has been superceded.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Alias
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1512
Location: East of the river Svartĺn
Joined: 11/19/04
Re: Breyer
Reply #54 - 03/14/12 at 09:33:21
Post Tools
There is an ancient book on the Breyer by Blackstock. From 1976(!).
  

Don't check me with no lightweight stuff.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Chessexplained
Junior Member
**
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 93
Location: Duisburg, Germany
Joined: 02/03/12
Gender: Male
Re: Breyer
Reply #53 - 03/14/12 at 09:09:29
Post Tools
My impression about the Breyer: unless you face extremely strong opposition or intend to play some specific sharper sub-line (there is stuff with an early ...d5 for instance) the Breyer can be played based on the study of games to learn the strategies behind it. I think such more middle game oriented study will help more here than a purely theoretical overview. That's at least how I would go about it.
  
Back to top
WWW  
IP Logged
 
gwnn
Senior Member
****
Offline



Posts: 472
Joined: 03/21/11
Re: Breyer
Reply #52 - 03/14/12 at 08:48:17
Post Tools
Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 03/14/12 at 08:03:04:
What are the best resources for the Breyer? Besides the recent Kaufman repertoire book, I have not seen a book dedicated to this opening, unless I am missing something.

It is a pity that there are not more books on this line; a 200+ page book on its theory would certainly be helpful.

There's also a Roman Labs video series on it. Otherwise, some books for white (Anand series, RL Move by Move). In other words, there are no resources.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #51 - 03/14/12 at 08:03:04
Post Tools
What are the best resources for the Breyer? Besides the recent Kaufman repertoire book, I have not seen a book dedicated to this opening, unless I am missing something.

It is a pity that there are not more books on this line; a 200+ page book on its theory would certainly be helpful.
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #50 - 02/01/12 at 02:25:22
Post Tools
It was with regards to the drawishness of the Breyer and other openings that are solid such as the Petroff. According to 365chess.com, 9...Nb8 yields 30,4%/47,5%/22,1% compared to 5. Nc3 Nxc3 6. dxc3 Petroff with 6. dxc3 as 41,6%/41,5%/16,9%.
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Volcanor
Junior Member
**
Offline



Posts: 61
Location: Switzerland
Joined: 03/16/09
Gender: Male
Re: Breyer
Reply #49 - 01/31/12 at 10:13:13
Post Tools
Regarding your values for the French exchange (White wins/Draw/Black wins: 27,9%/36,7%/35,5%), I consider that white players enter this line to draw, but are not very successfull: more Black wins than White wins probably means that black players have on average a higher rating than white players and succeed in winning. So, while the French exchange may seem drawish, the better player keeps good winning chances.

On the other hand, the values for the 5.Qe2 Petroff are completely different (White wins/Draw/Black wins: 17,5%/65,3%/17,3%). Almost twice as much draw as for the French exchange, and same win loss ratio for either color. So, if lower-rated white players go into this variation to draw (same assumption than for the French exchange), they seem to be successful.

Of course, statistics can be interpreted differently according to your purpose. According to my explanation, they give exactly the results that I had in mind before seeing them: the 5.Qe2-Petroff is much more drawish than the French exchange.

Finally, the reason we discuss it under the Breyer topic remains a mystery for me!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Gilchrist is a legend
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 1039
Location: Manchester, UK
Joined: 03/02/10
Re: Breyer
Reply #48 - 01/30/12 at 21:05:35
Post Tools
MNb wrote on 01/30/12 at 10:06:30:
You're somewhat contradicting yourself.

Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 01/30/12 at 06:17:16:
Petroff is actually not too drawish; the positions that arise can actually become quite unbalanced.


Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 01/30/12 at 06:42:41:
I do not think many players who face the Petroff want to play 5. Qe2 unless they for some reason desperately need a draw.

Because it's drawish.

Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 01/30/12 at 06:42:41:
Even in that case, if Black plays with intent and/or is a bit higher rated, then a draw is definitely not a sure result.

So the Petrov is not too drawish, but despite 5.Qe2 being drawish you are sure that the outcome is not sure.

Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 01/30/12 at 06:42:41:
5. Qe2 reminds me of an Exchange French without queens, which should not be too critical;

And if you are not sure that the result is not sure 5.Qe2 at least is not critical.

Gilchrist is a legend wrote on 01/30/12 at 06:42:41:
there have been some recent games in the Exchange French at IM/GM level and most of those games were not draws.

Ah - games in the French Exchange determine if the Petrov is drawish. Or if you were not saying that, why bringing it up?

Fyi: In 65% of the games with the French Exchange with both players 2400+ were drawn.
The percentage for the Petrov 5.Qe2 on that level is 98%; even the "Najdorf-like" 5.Nc3 saw 73% draws.
The Breyer: 52%.
Sometimes numbers say more than sophistic arguments.


I do not know how to search with 2400+, but doing a search on Chessgames.com, I got 5. Nc3 Nxc3 6. dxc3 Be7 7. Bf4 0-0 as White wins/Draw/Black wins as 40%/46,7%/13,3%, 7. Be3 0-0 in the same line gives 37,7%/44,3%/18%. 365chess.com search gives 6. dxc3 as 41,6%/41,5%/16,9%.

What I mean with regards to 5. Qe2 was that it appears drawish, but if Black just plays the endgame whilst disregarding the reputation of 5. Qe2, there is no reason why cannot strive for a win like in any other opening. 365chess.com search yields 17,5%/65,3%/17,3% for 5. Qe2, so there is scope for play.

The French Exchange was an analogy to 5. Qe2 specifically, as the Petroff 5. Qe2 being slightly similar to a French Exchange without queens. 365chess.com search gives 27,9%/36,7%/35,5% for Exchange French after 3...exd5. There are grandmasters such as Robert Hess who play the Exchange French for a win instead of a draw. I doubt many others deliberately do this, but there must be scope for play if he plays this way.
  

Creo lo que creo no importa lo que creen los demás.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 5
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo