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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials? (Read 20816 times)
fling
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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #9 - 02/22/12 at 14:43:07
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TonyRo wrote on 02/22/12 at 13:42:27:

EDIT  - 1000th post what! I was trying to time it to coincide with the pass-off of my book to editing, but alas, I likely jumped the gun by two weeks or so.  Huh


If you hurry with the analysis in e.g. the Botvinnik and Flick-knife variations, you might make it to 1500  Grin
  
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TN
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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #8 - 02/22/12 at 14:04:31
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An interesting point by TonyRo, which would be an argument in favour of using a 1.d4 Nf6 2.Nf3/c4 e6 move order to provide more flexibility against D-pawn specials while reaching the QGD against c4 lines. But I'm going way off-topic.

Returning to the subject, playing a Pirc against D-pawn specials reminds me of the phrase 'the cure is worse than the disease', though that isn't really the case for someone who plays the Pirc regularly against 1.d4. But going into a Pirc does seem to reward White for his unambitious play - better to play the critical lines and force the opponent to play precisely to equalise, if possible.  Wink
  

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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #7 - 02/22/12 at 13:51:22
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TonyRo wrote on 02/22/12 at 13:42:27:

I also get the OTB vibe that most D-Pawn Specials players (at least the lower-rated or less experienced ones) don't like playing against KID systems with ...d6, as opposed to 1...d5 systems, where they can use the e5-square as they please. This last thought deserves another thread entirely though.

Grin


This is something I think makes a lot of sense. At club level, the systems with 1.d4 d5 2. whatever not c4 is probably easier to handle for White than the 1.d4 Nf6 followed by 2 ...d6 precisely for the reason you give. I have seen an early Bf4 played against both Dutch Leningrad and KID-setups. To me it only invites ...d6 and maybe a later ...e5. And no Ne5, Bd3xh7-stuff!
  
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TonyRo
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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #6 - 02/22/12 at 13:42:27
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I'm confused as to the OP's insinuation that the D-Pawn Specials have long theory when compared to the sharp and unbalanced Pirc/Modern complex. The Austrian Attack in the Pirc/Modern together probably have as much theory in them as most of KID vs. D-Pawn Specials lines. 

Combine that with the fact that I'd much rather play against stuff like the Barry Attack or the Torre than the Austrian Attack in the Pirc, and you've got yourself an answer. I've found Dembo's book to be quite good for the D-Pawn Specials. A few nitpicks here or there, but I really like the chosen systems - she's always dynamic. 

I also get the OTB vibe that most D-Pawn Specials players (at least the lower-rated or less experienced ones) don't like playing against KID systems with ...d6, as opposed to 1...d5 systems, where they can use the e5-square as they please. This last thought deserves another thread entirely though.

Grin

EDIT  - 1000th post what! I was trying to time it to coincide with the pass-off of my book to editing, but alas, I likely jumped the gun by two weeks or so.  Huh
  
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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #5 - 01/01/12 at 12:46:30
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Well, I have been playing non-mainline D4 for a decade now (~2000 rating) and stand good against Nf6, d5 and f5. Surprise value, avoing theory muggers - call it what ever. However, I agree after g6 or d6, the best course is to go for mainline.
  
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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #4 - 12/31/11 at 20:07:13
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Amen to that.  KID stands in fairly high regard; Pirc less so.  The d-pawn special people that I know quite willingly play against the Pirc.
  

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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #3 - 12/30/11 at 20:48:35
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One of the d pawn specials is the sequence  1 d4 Nf6 2 Nf3 g6 3 Nc3. This aims either for a Barry attack style position after 3 .. d5 or a transposition to a Pirc after 3 .. Bg7 4 e4.

If ,as White, you believe the 150 attack ideas with Be3, Qd2 and Bd3 are strong, then it's a worthwhile transposition. You can even use the idea in the sequence 1 Nf3 d6 2 d4 etc.

Whether, as Black, provoking a 150 attack is a good idea depends on your confidence in Black's defensive resources.

With Black, you can meet almost anything with one of the Kings Indian, Pirc or Modern. The problem comes as to whether you can get a decent position from it.
  
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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #2 - 12/30/11 at 12:36:14
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The Dutch kills some D-pawn specials.  Grin

Honestly I don't see why you would want to avoid the d-pawn specials. If your opponent wants to forfeit their first-move advantage on move two or three then I wouldn't stop them. The only danger arises if you don't understand the equal position you get out of the opening.
  

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Re: Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
Reply #1 - 12/30/11 at 12:25:23
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Depends on the opponent I think. Overall its not objectively terribly sensible as you're accepting a lot of stuff if they do go e4, and thats quite comfortable for white with it so they might well have something low theory but reasonable booked. 

Now of course we do all know people who are really obsessed with playing one way, and yes a decent way to tweak their tails Smiley

Tromp folk you might annoy, Colle players rather less so. You might well want to be careful going f5 too early vs a Colle - that only really makes sense if you can stop e4 and not at all sure you will.
  
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Does The Pirc kill the d-Pawn Spacials?
12/30/11 at 10:10:18
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If I were thinking of palying the King's Indian Defence, what about studying the Picr/Modern in order to aovoid the long theory of d-Pawn Spacials? What are the pros and cons? In terms of load of work I think both need the same and I'd have another opening to expand my repertoire. I like the Pirc more than the Trompowsky and I think that answering d6/g6 to 1.d4 allows black to play f5 berfore Nf6 aganist London, Colle or Torre. Thanks for your comments.
  
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