Monocle wrote on 06/12/20 at 16:52:05:


We disagree on this point. My goal is to help him get up and running with some ideas for how to play with both colors. What you're suggesting makes perfect sense for a junior player, but I feel that it's not the right approach for my friend at this moment. There will be time for exploration later down the road. 

Monocle wrote on 06/12/20 at 16:52:05:


I was more speaking along the lines of Ordinary Chessplayer's thoughts on the QGD Exchange: such a line is easier to play with White than with Black, so in a game between two players with minimal knowledge of the opening my feeling is that Black will not have a good time. You do have a point about the average level of opening knowledge at that level; that is the area that I'm most uncertain about, as I enjoyed studying openings more than your average youngster when I first started playing. 

I looked at the Exchange line a bit today and I think that it'll be fine to recommend. There are some instructive ideas early on, such as that Black's ...Nh5 to relieve some of the pressure on his position. I understand that I'm overthinking it! On the other hand, I think that there is value in thinking about what a "lifetime repertoire" might look like for him.

By the way, speaking of the 6...Bd6 Semi-Slav, I was rather surprised at what happened in a blitz game between two IMs (in the "IM Not A GM Speed Chess Championship"):  1. d4 d5 2. c4 c6 3. e3 Nf6 4. Nf3 e6 5. Nbd2 Nbd7 6. Bd3 Bd6 7. 0-0 0-0 8. e4 de 9. Nxe4 Nxe4 10. Bxe4 (+=) Nf6 (I think it's basic knowledge in this line that this isn't good) 11. Bc2 c5 12. Bg5 cd 13. Qxd4 Be7.  Now White played 14. Rfd1, but apparently 14. Qh4 is winning (as given in old theory).

kylemeister wrote on 06/12/20 at 05:58:33:


I completely understand the sentiment, but I want to have something in mind when he inevitably asks "what do I do when White plays like this?" What about some version of the Steinitz? Like I said, I expect few players at that level will go for the Spanish anyway.

an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 06/12/20 at 11:28:44:


This is my feeling as well. I would have a junior player start with 1.e4, but in my friend's case, I think that it's not practical. I'm not familiar with the other 1.e4 books that you mentioned, but I do have a copy of Sielecki's 1.e4 book and in my opinion, it's too advanced for a 1200-1400 player. 

What is your concern with the London? In my mind, the advantage is that White develops easily and can get a pleasant position with natural moves if Black isn't careful. I will also consider your recommendations of Sielecki's 1.d4 repertoire and the Colle for White and the Semi-Slav for Black, although the Meran/Anti-Meran positions can be tricky if Black doesn't know what he's doing. What do you think about those positions at that level?

an ordinary chessplayer wrote on 06/12/20 at 12:12:39:


That is an excellent point and one of the reasons that I play dynamic systems with Black nowadays. Unfortunately, I don't think such an approach is practical in this case. Back in my QGD days I played the Alortsev, but now there's quite a lot of sharp theory there. I will look into the QGD options and also the Semi-Slav.

Monocle wrote on 06/12/20 at 14:57:55:


My intention certainly isn't to have him memorize opening theory. Rather, I want to teach him opening principles by (lightly) studying openings and I'm curious about which openings are suitable for that. For that reason, I'm inclined to go for 1.e4 e5 and 1.d4 d5, but I actively don't want to lead him towards positions where Black needs to know theory to survive. 

It's pretty clear that I'm not too familiar with the skill level of 1200-1400 players, which is why I started this thread!


Thank you all for sharing your thoughts!

BadDays wrote on 06/12/20 at 04:58:28:


No opening is a big deal at 1200-1400 level.  At that level, nobody is playing anything remotely as sophisticated as the Botvinnik Nge2/f3/e4 stuff.  Half the time, they won't even play Nc3 before cxd5.  You'd be lucky if the white player has ever even heard of a minority attack.  Both players will be out of theory by move 5.

I think you're overthinking this.  At 1200-1400 level, you can (and should) play entirely on opening principles with no concern for theory.  It doesn't matter if one or other player gets += from the opening, because the game will be decided by some unrelated random tactical opportunism anyway.

If I were you, I'd do this guy a solid and not bog him down in pointless opening study until he's at least 1800.

BadDays wrote on 06/12/20 at 04:58:28:

The Exchange Variation is dangerous in practice because white can play routine moves, whereas black has to play reactively. Black almost entirely depends on piece play and tactics. That's a difficult spot to be in if white is slightly stronger. Of course if white is considerably stronger then the opening hardly matters.

There's something to be said for just learning how to play the black side. If white doesn't play well then black can generate quite an attack, similar to what white sometimes gets in the Exchange Caro-Kann. The difference is that in the Exchange Caro-Kann, if white doesn't play great then it's equal, but in the Exchange QGD, if black doesn't play great then it's miserable. Chess should be fun, and playing black in such a system against a stronger opponent is not much fun.

I think as you suggested 3...Be7 is the way to go in the Classical QGD. Or since I suggested the Semi-Slav, 2...c6 is the better move order there. I don't think the Exchange Slav is anything for black to worry about. But if black is unwilling to face any exchange variation in any opening, that puts quite a limitation on the opening choices.

When I think of a 1200-1400 player playing something like the Breyer, I'm reminded of a line from Larsen (who recommended the Open to "club players") about "try[ing] to copy the grandmasters' strange positional maneuvers in the 5...B-K2 variation."