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More Chessbase "FWIW" Info RE: Komodo & Fritz18 (Read 3297 times)

Pawnpusher Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 274 Joined: 01/04/18 Gender:	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #7 - 05/17/23 at 10:47:40	Post Tools	Print Post
	It may be more evaluation, I read that Stockfish nets were trained using data from LcO.


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cathexis God Member Offline No matter where you go, there you are. Posts: 664 Location: Stafford, Virginia USA Joined: 03/03/20 Gender:	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #6 - 05/16/23 at 23:46:18	Post Tools	Print Post
	Well, I found your opinions enlightening to me. Thanks!


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Nernstian59 Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 296 Joined: 12/15/21	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #5 - 05/16/23 at 22:54:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	cathexis wrote on 05/16/23 at 00:27:10: Does it work with Fritz 17? cathexis - I was able to load Dragon 3.2 as the engine used for the analysis portion of Fritz 17. I just accepted the default choices during the installation of this engine, and Dragon 3.2 automatically appeared in the drop-down list of engines that could be selected in the analysis window. I haven't looked hard, but I don't see where I can play a game against Dragon 3.2 like I can against Fritz. However, I don't think that was your intended use. cathexis wrote on 05/16/23 at 00:27:10: is a NNUE a NNUE a NNUE? Based on my limited experience, it appears that some differences exist among the engines I often use. Lc0 tends to give me more optimistic evaluations for Black in closed positions such as those occurring in the French Winawer and the Hübner Variation of the Nimzo-Indian. Conversely, I've heard that some engines such as Stockfish favor White's space advantage in such structures. I'm much too ignorant to know if the variability in evaluation is truly a result of differences in the neural nets or if it's just due to how the evaluation functions of the various engines weigh factors such as space advantage vs. doubled pawns in the above positions. Perhaps a knowledgeable person could enlighten me here.


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cathexis God Member Offline No matter where you go, there you are. Posts: 664 Location: Stafford, Virginia USA Joined: 03/03/20 Gender:	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #4 - 05/16/23 at 00:27:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	Thx, I knew that. A bit off-topic perhaps, but two things I don't know is: 1. if there are any comparisons of Lc0 vs. Fat Fritz vs. Dragon 3.2 - or is a NNUE a NNUE a NNUE? 2. Does it work with Fritz 17? (or maybe that's why there is a Fritz 18 GUI included, hmmm...). [Edit, this post: https://www.chessengeria.com/post/komodo-dragon-3-released-in-fritz-gui seems to imply no, only Fritz 18. But it is a year old.]


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an ordinary chessplayer God Member Offline I used to be not bad. Posts: 1823 Location: Columbus, OH (USA) Joined: 01/02/15	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #3 - 05/15/23 at 21:56:03	Post Tools	Print Post
	cathexis wrote on 05/15/23 at 13:37:02: To be fair, you can get Dragon 3.2 (which also uses NNUE) for the lower price of about $75 U.S. directly from the komodo site. This price does not include a GUI, although the engine works with free GUIs, e.g. Arena.


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cathexis God Member Offline No matter where you go, there you are. Posts: 664 Location: Stafford, Virginia USA Joined: 03/03/20 Gender:	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #2 - 05/15/23 at 16:57:05	Post Tools	Print Post
	That's a good point. "Full Fritz GUI" is necessarily the same as the Fritz 18 engine. Instead your engine would be Dragon, presumed.


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Kerangali Full Member Offline I am every one and every zero Posts: 175 Joined: 02/12/22	Re: More Chessbase "FWIW" Info Komodo & Fritz18 Reply #1 - 05/15/23 at 13:49:33	Post Tools	Print Post
	reading from your post, the bundle seems to be for Komodo_engine + Fritz18_GUI (Graphic User Interface), ie Komodo running under Fritz_18 interface, but no Fritz18_engine. You may want to double-check if you're interested in Fritz18_engine.


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cathexis God Member Offline No matter where you go, there you are. Posts: 664 Location: Stafford, Virginia USA Joined: 03/03/20 Gender:	More Chessbase "FWIW" Info RE: Komodo & Fritz18 05/15/23 at 13:37:02	Post Tools	Print Post
	During the recent CB sale I was reading the offerings on the CB site. I noticed that they were promoting Komodo Dragon 3.2. But in reading that, the description also included this: Quote: Also included in Komodo Dragon 3.2: The current Fritz 18 user interface 6 months premium membership for playchess.com / ChessBase Account At non-sale price of 99.99 euros. I contacted support at CB and asked if this interface was a fully functioning copy of Fritz 18 or just some kind of "Reader" interface. I also asked whether Fritz 18 supports both the .cbh and newer .2cbh file formats. They wrote back: Quote: Yes, Komodo Dragon 3.2 comes with the full Fritz 18 GUI. No, the Fritz 18 GUI does not support the new format 2CBH that was introduced with CB 17 in November. So, this means that if you do not already have Fritz 18 you could get both Dragon and Fritz 18 for 100 euros whereas buying Fritz 18 alone would set you back about 80 euros ALTHOUGH you can no longer buy "classic" Fritz 18, only Power Fritz 18 which includes Fritz 18 Neuronal, a NNUE-style engine. It is the Power Fritz 18 that costs about 80 euros. Are you getting Power Fritz with Dragon? I doubt it, but don't know for sure. Also, it is possible (but I didn't ask) that the .2cbh files are used only by CB 17 and not needed by Fritz. I don't know. To try and get to a bottom line: it's possible that if you don't already have Dragon 3.2 and/or Fritz 18 of any flavor, then this might be a smarter way to acquire both for one price. Lc0 is a free download and I am not even sure about the current legal status of Fat Fritz, but it came with my copy of Fritz 17 anyway. To be fair, you can get Dragon 3.2 (which also uses NNUE) for the lower price of about $75 U.S. directly from the komodo site. My only goal is to share knowledge. As always, FWIW


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