Strategy_Rules wrote on 08/07/06 at 20:20:09:


There are two "main problems."  The line you point out, which is perfectly good for Black, and 4...Nf6, which is perfectly good for Black.  That's why the Scotch Gambit isn't seen in top-level chess.  However, at the club level and especially for young and improving players, I think it's a fine way to play the White pieces.  You should learn to play this way before you undertake the long lines of the Spanish, etc., etc.

MNb wrote on 09/18/04 at 20:31:54:


very interesting. I missed that (sort of) transposition.

Markovich's 13.Qxe4 Bxd4  14.Qxd4 Be2+ 15.Bxe2 Qxd4  16.Nd2 Qxe5  17.Nf3 Qc5 doesn't look so bad for White though.

some more material...

J.Arnott-M.Hebden, British rapid, Halifax 2003
9....Bg4+ 10.Kf1 Qh4 11.Qxd5 Ng3+? 12.hxg3 Qxh1+ 13.Kxf2 0–0 14.Ne7+ Kh8 15.Bg5 Rad8 16.Qe4 Rd1 17.Qxg4 and White won (eventually)

J.Arnott-J.Tait, Sheffield League 2003 (the following week)
9...bxc6 10.Bxc6+ Kf8 11.Qxd5 Bg4+ 12.Kf1 Qxd5?? (12...Bb6 - dunno what I was thinking) 13.Bxd5 Rd8 14.Bxe4 Rd1+ 15.Kxf2 Rxh1 16.Nd2 Ke7 17.Nf1 1–0

J.Arnott-J.Tait, Sheffield League 2004
9...Bg4+ 10.Kf1 Qd7 11.e6 Bxe6 12.Nd4 c6 13.Nxe6 Qxe6 14.Bd3 Bb6 15.Bxe4 dxe4 16.Qe2 0–0 17.Nc3 e3 18.a4 Rfe8 19.g3 Qh3+ 20.Ke1 Rad8 21.Qf3 Qe6 22.a5 Bd4 23.Ne2 Bc5 24.Ra4 b5 25.axb6 Bxb6 26.h3 Qd6 27.Kf1 Qd1+ 28.Kg2 Qxc2 29.Rg4 Rd2 30.Re1 Red8 (both players in time trouble) 31.b4 f5 32.Rh4 g6 33.g4 Rf8? (33...Rd1 34.Rxd1 Rxd1 35.gxf5 Re1-+) 34.g5 Re8 35.Kf1 Rd1 36.Qf4 Rd4? (36...Bd4) 37.Nxd4 Bxd4 38.Bxe3 Bxe3 39.Qc4+ Qxc4+ 40.Rxc4 and White won.

I prefer the white pieces.

Pinski does not mention the line brought up by MNb, but it looks strong indeed. I don't know if Pinski looked at this line, but I have got no good advice for White. Even 13.Qxe4 looks more promising for Black.

I find Pinski's idea 8.Nxc6? Bxf2+ 9.Ke2 hard to believe. Compared with 9.Kf1 Qh4 the line 9.Ke2 Bg4+ 10.Kf1 gives Black an extra attacking piece. After Qh4! 11.Qxd5 Bb6 12.Nd4+ c6 13.Bxc6+ bxc6 14.Qxc6+ Bd7 15.Qxa8+ Ke7 Black wins.
The same position arises after 9.Kf1 Qh4 when the Black bishop goes from c8 to d7.

Feb,

9. Ke2!? is interesting; I had never considered it.  I agree that 9...Qd7 seems best.  Then 10. e6 Bxe6  11. Nd4 c6  would appear to be forced.

I then looked at 12. Nxe6 Qxe6  13. Bd3 Bb6  14. Bxe5 exd5.

What a position!  In spite of the reduced material and that the Black rooks are not yet active, I think that White is in so much trouble with his king that Black may actually have more than enough compensation.  That e-pawn is going to look a lot like a piece when it gets to e3.

But these are only preliminary impressions.  Thanks for the info!

7...Bd7 often transposes to the 7...Bc5 lines. Is there a particular independent line with 7...Bd7 or a move-order problem which makes you prefer 7...Bc5? 

Btw. After 7...Bc5 8.Nxc6 Bxf2+, Pinski mentions an interesting idea 9.Ke2!? in his book: 9...Bg4+ [9...Qh4?! 10.Qxd5] 10.Kf1! Qd7 [10...Bxd1? 11.Nxd8+ Kxd8 12.Nc3 Nxc3 13.Bg5+ is good for White] 11.e6 Bxe6 12.Nd4 c6. I think 9...Qd7 deserves attention.

Quote:

Yes Ne4 is the recomended move but i think after Be3 then either Nc3 or d2 depending on weather black castles or plays Bb6 and then Nb3 white will just have an advantage.