Uberdecker wrote on 05/10/07 at 10:04:12:


Here I completely agree. This self interest needed Bush as a masqotte. As you will probably know, the most convincing liars are those, who believe their own lies. You see, in a cynical way I think Bush is sincere.
I have read some unrefuted theories (from not-extreme Americans), that especially Cheney had financial interest via his former companies in the Iraq war.

Uberdecker wrote on 05/10/07 at 10:04:12:


See Willempie's reaction. Of course I cannot be sure, but I shared his fear.

Uberdecker wrote on 05/10/07 at 10:04:12:


As I think Sarkozy is smarter than Bush, I am pretty sure, he will not involve France in a war that is doomed to be lost. This is exactly what Bush did. What was even worse, every human being with enough information and a little common sense could see it happen from the earliest beginning.
On such matters I am a Macchiavellist myself.  I don't give a d##n about Saddam Hussein, UN-legitimacy or whatever. The question I ask is simply this: has the invasion of Iraq contributed to a bigger safety of the world? Has it improved the circumstances of the Iraq people? Has it contributed to political stability in the Middle East?
The answers are clearly no and were clearly no back in 2003. I am very sure, Macchiavelli would have disapproved of Bush' policy, for the simple reason, that the USA has lost more than it has gained. Once again, I think Sarkozy is smart enough to avoid such mistakes (well, stupidities that is).

Dji wrote on 05/08/07 at 15:24:25:

I guess the original epitaph was :
"Ci-git un fameux Cardinal
Qui fit le bien et fit le mal.
Le bien quil fit, il le fit mal,
Le mal qu'il fit, il le fit bien".

Uberdecker wrote on 05/10/07 at 10:04:12:


Looks like the chesspub censors are at work here! . Well, as far as i'm concerned, the man with the censored name is indeed as his name is. The same with Rumsfeld AND Bush.

[quote author=Uberdeker link=1178349533/0#9 date=1178464556][quote author=MNb link=1178349533/0#5 date=1178396670][quote author=Willempie link=1178349533/0#1 date=1178364204]Ah the cute incompetent vs the guy with some weird ideas ;D
Pity Bayrou didnt make it :-/[/quote]
The weird ideas will prevail. We should be happy with it, as incompetence usually is even more harmful, as Bush has proved once again last few years.
[/quote]

This is really a very bad example.  Bush's war-mongering, securitarian ideas and reactionary stances have done infinitely more harm than his incompetence. The incompetence of Ségolène Royal is nothing to be afriad of. She would not have made any subtancial economic or social reforms. The country would simply have stagnated as it has since the creation of the 5th republic. The French could easily have lived with that. [/quote]

I strongly dispute, that Bush had any (even war-mongering, securitarian and reactionary) idea of what he was doing, especially in Iraq. His IQ is simply not high enough. Please listen back, to what Bush said about the Iraq-invasion and Saddam Hussein in 2003. It is simply impossible to contradict such factual nonsense.
I was also quite afraid of the (international) blunders Mme Royal would have committed as a French president. Please note: my natural sympathy was with her. No way I would ever have voted for Sarkozy. Probably I would have stayed home.
Actually it has become clear, that 55% of the French electorate could [i]not[/i] live with the incompetence of Mme Royal. I am afraid, that I can do nothing but understand that.

Quote:

  Je la connais pas celle-là!
   En français cela donne quoi!

[quote author=Uberdeker link=1178349533/0#8 date=1178452102] . Only the ideas of the extreme right have been receiving ligitimacy recently and have fueled Sarkozy's rise to presidency. Where do you think all LePen's votes from 2002 have gone ? . [/quote]

Very good analyse!!

You mean it is time for reactionary populism to take over ? While, I certainly wouldn't feel at ease with the communists or trotskyists in power, they do not pose any threat at the moment. Only the ideas of the extreme right have been receiving ligitimacy recently and have fueled Sarkozy's rise to presidency. Where do you think all LePen's votes from 2002 have gone ? For those who don't know, LePen is a far right politician who made the second round last election ahead of the moderate socialist Jospin. As much as am wary of the reds, the threat to democracy is not coming from them.