Sorry to awaken this old thread but I need to correct some technically incorrect syntax information I gave on entering data into the winboard.ini file.

I need to correct it primarily for two reasons:

1). So I can sleep at night.

2). So that Michael or anyone else that might happen to use the information I gave will not begin early with the bad habit I picked up.


First off the Winboard help file says this concerning entering the syntax I am going to speak about.

Quote:


So going by the above help file quote these examples are correct:

Quote:


Quote:



The rybka12f.ini and the -winboard -hashsize 33554432 shown above are command line arguements to the engine, so having everything enclosed by single quote marks as shown above is correct. Instead of calling them command line arguements some people refer to them as parameters.

You will probably mostly see people use double quotes instead of single quotes. Either single or double quotes is correct. If you want to be more inline with what others do you can use double quote marks.

Quote:


Quote:




Now to my faulty, incorrect syntax, even though the way I showed still works


When dealing with an engine that has no command line arguements to it, you do not enclose the engine name in quote marks.

Examples of incorrect syntax that I gave:


Quote:


Quote:


Quote:



The above engine entries have no command line arguements to them so I am wrong to have put any quote marks (single or double quote marks) around them.

This is how the above examples should be entered into the winboard.ini file:


Quote:


Quote:


Quote:



I hope that anyone that may have used the information I gave in this thread will see this post and make the necessary changes to their habits and winboard.ini files. Do it for no other reason than to be syntantically correct, please.




This is the complete paragraph from the Winboard help file that the partial quote above was taken from:


Quote:

In the 7zip file that you downloaded from Alex Guerrero's site is a folder named 'Winboard_Manager_1.3b' move everything that is in this folder to your Winboard and engines folder (where the winboard.exe file is). Delete or move your current winboard.ini file from your Winboard and engines folder and have Winboard make a new winboard.ini file (you know how to do this). Then open WinMan and afterwards it is kind of intuitive what to do. I just tried it here and WinMan worked. Any problems, I believe Alex Guerrero's e-mail address is listed on his site. He would be the one to provide technical answers.

Edited Post: After making the below post I had to come back and change some information I had originally given. It should be accurate now. What I had originally posted wasn't inaccurate as such it is just now more correct.


OK, first off I paid for Rybka 2.3.2a so when I read that you had gotten 2.3.2a from Peshka I downloaded Peshka because surely you were mistaken. But there it was, a 32-bit single-processor version of 2.3.2a.

Now quickly on to the problem of it not working with polyglot.


There are two options you have (I recommend the second option below):

First Option

In the polyglot ini file locate where it reads - EngineCommand=Rybka v2.3.2a.w32 and put an .exe extension on the end (shown below) and it should work. (The engine's exe file name has a space and periods in it so the .exe extension is needed)

EngineName=Rybka 2.3.2a 32-bit
EngineDir=C:\Program Files\Chess\Chess Engines\Rybka 2.3.2a
EngineCommand=Rybka v2.3.2a.w32.exe
Book=true
BookFile=C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot\books\Rybka.bin
Log=false
LogFile=Rybka232a32-bit.log
 

Second Option

Change the engine's file name from - Rybka v2.3.2a.w32 - to something else, as an example - Rybka232a - no periods and no spaces in the name just to be on the safe side.

Then in the polyglot.ini file in the EngineCommand= area put the name you shortened the engine name to in that space. ex: EngineCommand=Rybka232a (no periods and no spaces in the name).

The caveat is that most non-installer engines that are downloaded we just put in a folder and away we go. So most non-installer engines can probably have their exe files safely renamed. But I am not 100% sure of that. I know you can safely rename the Rybka executable file and the Crafty exe, etc. But there might well be exceptions I am not aware of so I do not want you to accept what I say as the absolute truth for all engines. You have to remember that I have only dealt with about fifteen engines total, UCI and Winboard.

Now installer type engines like Hiarcs I would not change the executable file name of. Those type engines make registry entries when being installed so changing the executable name might have nasty consequences. I also have the paid for version of Delfi (but it is not currently installed) and that engine does not have an installer as such but it does require registration so I would not change that executable's file name either.

It would be a rare occasion when it would be necessary to rename an exe file, this Rybka 2.3.2a engine not withstanding, so just have to take it on an engine by engine basis again.

**********************************************

When naming the polyglot.ini file of an engine make sure the file name you give it has no spaces or periods in it. ex: rybka232a - is a good polyglot ini file name. Do that just to avoid any possible problems.


**********************************************


Lastly, Let me try to explain clearly what the Polyglot_GUI utility is. I think so far I have done a very poor job of explaining it. The Polyglot_GUI is only used to make the initial polyglot.ini file for a chess engine to use with polyglot. Thereafter all editing of the ini file is done by opening the ini file with a text editor and doing any editing manually (by hand). Unless you want to recreate an ini file for an engine again you wouldn't use the Polyglot_GUI again with an engine that you have already made a polyglot.ini file for.

Before Alex Guerrero released the Polyglot_GUI utility a few months ago, all polyglot.ini files were made by hand. The Polyglot_GUI just automates the process. Some people probably still make their polyglot.ini files by hand.


On the question of the polyglot book path in the Polyglot_GUI that for some reason has become a stumbling block. By default the Polyglot_GUI assigns the book path as:

...\directory-where-the-Polyglot_GUI-resides\book.bin


Now if I go to make a polyglot.ini file for Rybka and I input into the Polyglot_GUI the path where I have the polyglot book to be used:

ex: C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot\books\Rybka.bin

And I click 'save' at the bottom of the Polyglot_GUI, when I check the polyglot.ini file I will see in the polyglot.ini file the book path of - C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot\books\Rybka.bin


Now when I click the 'save' button at the bottom of the Polyglot_GUI the utility closes.


Now when I go to make a polyglot.ini file for another chess engine and the Polyglot_GUI interface opens up this will be in the polyglot book path:

...\directory-where-the-Polyglot_GUI-resides\book.bin

It shows the default path - ...\directory-where-the-Polyglot_GUI-resides\book.bin - everytime the utility is opened.


I hope that clears things up. If you are having problems with the book path other than what is mentioned above, I do not have an answer for you other than maybe it is an operating system related problem - or possibly a D: drive problem. Like I have already mentioned, if I am going to use a polyglot book with an engine I change the book path manually after the polyglot.ini file has been made.

So I recommend not worrying about changing the polyglot book path through the Polyglot_GUI though you can but changing it manually (by hand) in the polyglot ini file.



I think I have covered all I can cover in these posts in this thread. Enough to where if you have a problem with an engine not running that you have enough information on what to look for that might be causing the problem. I am using a pre-Windows XP computer and quite a few of the present day chess engines will not run on my computer because they were compiled for Windows XP and above.


Good Luck

Caution: More Graphics Ahead

The below only has to do with the Polyglot_GUI


I will show you how to trim down the Polyglot Section of the Polyglot_GUI by removing some of the entries. Doing so may make it easier to work with. I know that some real chess engine experts do use the entries but for us novices they are mostly not needed by us and if they ever are needed we can add them to the polyglot.ini file manually or put the needed entries back into the Polyglot_GUI.

The below graphic shows how the polyglot section in the Polyglot_GUI looks by default.




Go to the folder where you have the Polyglot_GUI utility. And with the Polyglot_GUI program closed, right click the 'Polyglot-Section.wbm' file and open it with a text editor. I am using wordpad.






And make the changes to the file that are shown in the below graphic. The entries that remain are the bare minimum that you will need to use polyglot. Some of the entries that will be left are necessities. Only remove what is shown in the graphic.







Below is a graphic showing all of the entries that are left in the file. Of course, after making the changes, save the changes when closing the file.






And opening the Polyglot_GUI and clicking on an UCI chess engines exe file the Polyglot_GUI interface opens and the below graphic shows what we have now. A lot easier to work with.






Thank Alex Guerrero for this excellent utility/program.


I really suspect that any problems you have with getting engines to work in the Winboard GUI will be more engine related than anything else. You really need to look into the engine documentation for clues as to what the problem(s) might be. The whole time I have been using Winboard I have probably only used about fifteen different engines in it. I'm not really a chess engine person. I was only looking for a few to play games against when I started and for me that is how it has been up to this point.

No Delfi wasn't a bad choice as such even though as you write it can be used as a Winboard engine. So in the Winboard GUI it might seem obvious to run it as a Winboard engine, but you can do UCI if you want.


I didn't have Delfi installed so downloaded the free version. And as you write when running it as a UCI engine there is no option for not using the Delfi book. I also checked the Delfi.ini file that is in the engine's directory and there is no book on/off option there either. So Delfi is a bad option for trying to use a polyglot book with. Looks like with Delfi you are stuck using its default 'own' book. So in the polyglot.ini file (or whatever name you have given it for the Delfi engine) in the polyglot section you would need to have - Book=false


After having the polyglot_GUI make an initial ini file you can always open the file with a text editor and make changes to it manually. So you could edit/alter the path to the polyglot book manually instead of doing it through the polyglot_GUI. The same as you could change Book=true to Book=false manually. I'm always making changes to the engine section of the polyglot.ini files manually. I just have the polyglot_GUI make the initial file - it is a lifesaver in that regard. Afterwards everything is manual for that ini file (that is just my M.O.).


Quote:


Yea this is a bummer. Every ini file that is made by the polyglot_GUI has this as part of the path by default. No way for us to change it. Actually when I make a polyglot.ini file I just let it set this as the path and change it manually in the ini file. But as a test I just edited the path to the polyglot book from within the polyglot_GUI and my edited path was reflected in the polyglot.ini file that was made so I don't know what is going on on your end.


Afterthought: The reason you cannot choose whether to have the Delfi engine not use its own opening book is because the engine's programmer has not made that an option with his engine. Nothing is broken. I have only dealt with a few chess engines and they all have their different options. It depends on what the engine's developer has done.


If you want try Ufim and turn off its opening book and try to set it up with a polyglot book. BTW, Ufim is Winboard/UCI and for some reason I always run it as an UCI engine.


I don't mind attempting to answer questions if I am able to answer them.

Hi again,

BugChess now works just fine -- thank you! Crafty though is still wonky: the board appears and I make a move, but Crafty takes three minutes to answer! Funny in a sense, 'cos the same file works fine in Arena.

I'm hoping to get some time later today to try some UCI engines. And yes, I'm sure I'll get on to ProDeo 1.2 stuff in a while -- thanks for the link!

While having a cuppa after breakfast today I played this five-minute game with Scorpio (Black). I was a bit surprised at the program's play 'cos it's meant to be 2700+, but maybe some 'horizon' effect was going on? H'mm ...


1. d4 d5 2. Nf3 e6 3. e3 Nf6 4. Bd3 Bd6 5. O-O O-O 6. b3 c5 7. Bb2 Nc6 8. Nbd2 cxd4 9. exd4 Qc7 10. a3 Bd7 11. Qe2 Ng4 12. h3 Nh2 13. Nxh2 Bxh2+ 14. Kh1 Bf4 15. g3 Bh6 16. f4 e5!? [I'd assumed this wasn't good but it seems to be OK] 17. dxe5 Bxh3 18. Rf2 Qd7?! [18... Be6!?] 19. f5 d4?! [19 ...Ne7!?] 20. Qh5?! [20 Qe4!?] Bxd2!? (20... Be3!?] 21. Rxd2 Qd5+ 22. Kh2 Bg4 23. Qxg4 Nxe5 24. Qe2 Nf3+ 25. Kh3 Rae8 26. Qf2 Re3? [What's this?? Surely it had to snaffle the Rook first] 27. Re2 Ng5+ 28. Kh2 Nf3+ 29.Kh3 [Returning the compliment. It was very hard to play 29. Kh1! against silicon, but after 29 ...Ne1+ 30. Kg1 White seems to be doing well] 29... Ng5+ 30. Kh2 [30. Kg4 Ne4 31. Qf4 Rxg3+ 32.Qxg3 h5+ looks very messy but 30. Kh4!? Ne4 31. Qg2 Qxf5 32. Bxe4 Qf6+ 33. Kg4 is good for White? Obviously I couldn't begin to work any of this out!]  30... Nf3+ [And now with 16 seconds left I bailed out ...] 31. Kh3[?] 1/2-1/2

Hi and thanks again for posts! I shall try again with Crafty and BugChess later this morning.

Re your last post on spacing: actually, I have a space [i]only[/i] after the 'discretionary' initial program name, but [i]not [/i] before /scp or before /fcp! And yet Scorpio works fine! So should I always include these spaces?

Come to think of it, what do 'fd', 'fcp', 'sd' and 'scp' actually stand for, if they do?

Congratulations Michael!!

I know I was satisfied when I was first able to start figuring a few things out about setting up engines in the Winboard GUI. It took me time of seaching on the Internet, etc. till I got to that point and honestly a few times I gave up on using the Winboard GUI but for some reason kept coming back to it and attempting to get it right. There is absolutely nothing in my posts above that I found out on my own; I just collectively put into one place things I had found out in bits and pieces in postings of other people on the Internet.



A couple of things about what you posted above:

In a post above I wrote this-

Quote:



Michael you have hit upon two exceptions with Crafty and BugChess.


On Crafty


Michael Ayton wrote on 07/05/09 at 21:58:23:



Notice the engine name you posted for Crafty from your ini file - crafty-23.0-win32


From the Winboard GUI help file.


Quote:



The Crafty engine name in the winboard.ini file you posted has a period [.] in it. So since the name already has a period in it you do have to put the .exe extension on the end of it. So the engine name in the Winboard ini file should be - crafty-23.0-win32.exe

Adding the .exe extension to your winboard.ini file for the Crafty engine name should get it running. You still have to edit the Crafty.rc file if desired, but even if you were using the Crafty Winboard engine in the Arena GUI or some other GUI you would still have to deal with the .rc file. It isn't like the Winboard GUI alone is making us have to deal with this.



On BugChess


I did not have BugChess installed so downloaded it. Like for you, BugChess stalled on startup and I had to use Ctrl+Alt+Del to close it.

Looking in the read me file that came with the engine I noticed this-

Quote:



Doing a search engine search on the engine found this page.

http://wbec-ridderkerk.nl/html/details1/BugChess2.html

Notice this part on the above web page.

Quote:


Especially this part.

Quote:




This is my entry for BugChess in my winboard.ini file. And the engine started and when I made a move the engine responded. I did not finish a full game so if other problems exist I am not aware of them. Sometimes problems do exist with engines and if problems do exist it is not necessarily a Winboard GUI problem, it may well just be a problem with the engine.

}
/firstChessProgramNames={"Hiarcs 10" /fd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /fcp='polyglot hiarcs10.ini'
"Marquis 0.1.6" /fd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Chess Engines\Marquis" /fcp='marquis'
"Rybka 1.2f" /fd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /fcp='polyglot rybka12f.ini'
"ProDeo 1.4" /fd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /fcp='polyglot prodeo14.ini'
"Ufim 8.02" /fd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /fcp='polyglot ufim802.ini'
"Bugchess" /fd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Chess Engines\Bugchess" /fcp='BugChess2_V1_6_3 -winboard -hashsize 33554432'
}
/secondChessProgramNames={"Hiarcs 10" /sd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /scp='polyglot hiarcs10.ini'
"Marquis 0.1.6" /sd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Chess Engines\Marquis" /scp='marquis'
"Rybka 1.2f" /sd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /scp='polyglot rybka12f.ini'
"ProDeo 1.4" /sd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Polyglot" /scp='polyglot prodeo14.ini'
"Bugchess" /sd="C:\Program Files\Chess\Chess Engines\Bugchess" /scp='BugChess2_V1_6_3 -winboard -hashsize 33554432'
}
 

One other thing. In my first post in this thread I had suggested that you delete the Winboard GUI package that you first had. I think it is called 'Winboard Gold Pack'.

Just to let you know you can still keep that Gold Pack setup and have it, and your current Winboard setup in different program folders. There will be no conflict between the two Winboards. Except they will have to use their own winboard.ini file. It is best not to interchange winboard.ini files between different versions of Winboard. Some changes may exist in the winboard.ini files for one version of Winboard that do not exist in a previous or future versions of Winboard.


I have three different Winboard versions at this time. (Graphic)

1). Winboard_X
2). Winboard_F (I just have the folder labelled Winboard_F to distinguish it, It is just H.G. Muller's Winboard version.)
3). And a test version that H.G. Muller recently released.


There is no conflict between these three versions. So if you want the Gold Pack version, do put it also on your OS.



By my post in this thread it may seem that I am a Winboard GUI nut or something. I'm not. I was just trying to help Michael Ayton, and maybe some others, out. I think the Winboard GUI could be used by someone to do serious chess study, but then so could Arena. And no doubt that for serious chess study Chessbase or Convekta products are a/the way to go.


BTW, if you play chess variants I can't help you set them up in Winboard. I have no experience. You are on your own.

Let us know how you get on with the UCI engines. And Michael, I'd like to see you set up a ProDeo chess engine as a Winboard engine and change the engine personalities through the winboard.ini file. Info on doing that here.