sloughter wrote on 11/18/10 at 19:49:26:


How many takebacks did you use? Or did you play the same variation over and over until you didn't lose?

This is highly complicated and difficult to memorize. I think the Traxler Attack is great for correspondence play. If you can remember all this in over-the-board play, then you will have a significant advantage as Black.

Djy wrote on 10/07/10 at 18:40:56:


6...Qe8 looks better than 6...Rf8 & White just retains the first move advantage. I think that 6...Rf8 is +/-




Here is a potential cook of the main line of the Wilkes-Barre/Traxler. This was played against Fritz 12 at 60'99

5.Bxf7ch Ke7 6.Bb3 Rf8 (Na5?! 7.c3! Nxb3 8.Qxb3 +/-) 7.d3 d6 8.Be3 Bg4?! 9.Nf3! Bxe3? (Bb6 is better to try to open the a-file. 9...Bxe3 is just bad giving White the ability to contest the f-file) 10.fxe3 Qd7 (To connect the Rooks. You will note that Black can't walk its King east because of the b3 Bishop) 11.Nbd2 Rae8 12.Qe2 Kd8 13.O-O-O Kc8

There is no compensation for the pawn so Black is in need of a major resource prior to move 11--probably 9...Bb6, but White can just castle Queenside and force Black to capture on e3. Otherwise White just plays Nbd2 & Qe2; the sacrifice on f3 looks dubious.

14.h3! Be6 15.g4! Kb8 16.Kb1! (This prevents the Qe6/Nb4 nonsense) Bxb3 17.Nxb3 h6 18.Rdf1 g5? (A horrible positional error but Black is worse no matter what)

19.Rf2 Re7 20.Rhf1 Ref7 21.Nh2 a5 22.Nd2! (Heading for f5) Qe6 23.a3 (This is why it is not necessary or desirable to meet a5 with a4) Nd7?! (This floored me until I realized that White was threatening Rf3/R1f2/Qf1 with a heavy piece alignment called Alekhine's gun)

24.Rxf7 Rxf7 25.Rxf7 Qxf7 26.Qf3! Qg7 27.Ndf1 Nc5 28.Ng3 b6 29.Nh5! Qe7 30.Qf6! Qxf6 (Forced---otherwise Black loses its Kingside pawns) 31.Nxf6 +- Ne7 32.Nf1 Kc8 33.Ng3 Nd7 34.Nxd7 Kxd7 35.Nf5 Ng8 36.Kc1 Kc6 37.Kd2 b5 38.Kc3 Kb6 39.b3 Kc6 40.d4 Kd7 41.Kd3 Ke6 42.c4 bxc4 43.Kxc4!? Nf6?! (The best practical try?) 44.d5ch Kd7 45.Nxh6 Nxe4 46.Kb5 Nc3ch 47.Kxa5 Nxd5 48.Nf7?! (Nf5 perhaps) Nxe3 49.Nxg5

Now in a completely winning position I drift off into a draw: 49...Nc2 50.a4? (Ka4) Kc6 51.h4? (Unnecessarily pitching a pawn to get my King in play. Obviously, all White has to do to win is centralize his King and Knight, then invade with his King because the Knight can't leave the Kingside and the King can't leave the Queenside) 

51...Ne3 52.Kb4 Nxg4 53.Nf7 Nf6 54.Kc3 Nh5 55.b4 Nf4 56.Ng5 Nh5 57.Nf7 Nf4 58.Ng5 Nh5 59.Nf7 1/2-1/2.

Even when I forced the draw White probably still has winning chances,again, by centralizing his Knight and King.

There doesn't seem much good for Black after 6...Rf8 7.d3 d6 8.Be3. Black cannot capture on e3 because it is always bad for Black to force off both sets of Rooks a pawn down with no compensation, but this is unavoidable or White just owns the f-file.

MNb wrote on 10/06/10 at 10:35:35:

You 've right Mnb ,so probably 8.-h6 is better than 8.-Nd4

A brief comment on Conquistador's post about 1.e4 e5 2.Nf3 Nc6 3.Bc4 Nf6 4.Ng5 Bc5 5.d4 d5 6.Bxd5 Nxd4 7.Nxf7?! Qe7 8.Nxh8 Bg4

Now critical is 9.Qd2 Nxd5 10.exd5 (10.c3 0-0-0!? - instead of 10...Nf6 - 11.ed Rxd5 12.dc? ed+ -+, or 12.b4 Bxb4 13.cb Qxb4! 14.0-0 Ne2+ -+, or 12.h3 Qh4 13.cd Rxd4 -+) 10...Bf5 11.0-0 (11.d6!?) Nxc2 12.g4?! (12.Qe2) Qh4 and instead of 13.Qg5 White can force a draw with 13.fg Qg4+ 14.Kh1 Qf3+ =. The only winning attempt here is 12...Nd4 13.Kg2 Bxg4 14.f3 Bxf3 15.Rxf3 Nxf3 16.Kxf3 0-0-0, but it is unclear. 

9.Bf7+ Kf8 10.f3? Nxe4 11.fxg4 Qh4+ 12.g3 Nxg3 13.Bg5 Qxg5 14.hxg3 Qe3+ 15.Kf1 Nf5 is won for Black as mate is inevitable. This was played in Karlsen,H.-Nordby,B./corr. 1985. However, there's one more move to be considered. 11.h4 "is a real try for saving the game" (Heisman). But it also fails. 11...Nf5! and now

• 12.Qd5? Bf2+ 13.Kd1 Rd8 -+ (Hanison,B.-Kuijpers,GFM/corr. 1998)
• 12.fe Bxd1 13.fe Bxc2 14.Nc3 Qd6 -+
• 12.Qd3 Bf2+ (Heisman only mentioned 12...Nf2 which is worse) 13.Kd1 Rd8 14.Bd5 Nf6 15.fg Rxd5 16.gf Rxd3+ 17.cd Qd7 -+

Sadly for Black, it's not the whole story. 10.Qd3! and he can fix a draw with 10...Be2 11.Qh3 Bg4 12.Qd3 or continue 10...Rd8, but after 11.Nc3 White is coming back to life.

After 9.f3? Nxd5 10.fxg4 inclusion of 10...Nb4? is unnecessary: 11.0-0! and the game is not that clear. Better is immediate 10...Qh4+ with the rest as given by Conquistador (see Kunze,F.-Giertz,A./corr. 1976). Also, 10.fg is not the only White's option.

• 10.ed. Now Heisman gives 10...Bf5 as the main line, but what he suggests further is not convincing. Probably the most direct way for Black is again 10...Qh4+ 11.g3 (11.Kd2? Bf5 -+) 11...Qh3 12.fg Qg2 -+, transposing to 10.fg
• 10.h4!? is a silicon's choice and it is pretty consistent because of preventing Qe7-h4+. I'm not quite sure about Black's best response, probably 10...Nb4 11.c3 0-0-0 keeping very strong attack. After 11.Na3 in Szabo,I.-Lehmann/corr. 1984 Black apprehensively played 11...h6? preparing castling and subsequently lost. But after 11...0-0-0 12.Bg5 is in fact loosing: 11...0-0-0! 12.Bg5 Qf8 13.Bxd8 Bxf3! -+

9.Qd3 Nxd5 10.c3 Nb4 11.cxb4 Bxb4+ 12.Nc3 Qd7 13.Kf1 Bxc3 14.f3 and Black has spectacular possibility 14...Bxf3! -+, exposing enemy's king. 

• 15.gf Qh3+ 16.Kf2 Ba5 followed by 17...Bb6
• 15.Kf2 and only now 15...Ba5 which after 16.gf Qh3 transposes to 15.gf.

Upd. Conquistador did not mention 8.c3 ("a real try", according to Heisman). Black should play 8...Bg4 trying to change game's flow back into 8.Nxh8 course, e.g.
9.Qd2 Nxd5 10.Nxh8 0-0-0 transposes to 8.Nxh8 Bg4 9.Qd2
9.Qd3 Nxd5 10.Nxh8 Nb4 transposes to 8.Nxh8 Bg4 9.Qd3
Only after 9.f3 there's no variant to transpose to. 9...Nxf3 10.gf Nxd5

• 11.Qxd5 Qh4+ 12.Kd2 Qf2+ 13.Kd3 Bxf3 14.Kc4 Be7 -+
• 11.fg Qxf7 12.Rf1 Nf4 -/+
• 11.Qe2 Nf4 12.Bxf4 Bxf3! 13.Qxf3 Qxf7 14.Nd2 Qxf4 -/+

Yes.  The Traxler is refuted by 5.Bxf7+ and so forth.  I would never consider 5.Nxf7 which, whether or not it succeeds, is too difficult to prepare and gives Black too much of what he wants.

I did not.  Thank you for pointing it out.  Obviously I need to spend more time working on that variation than eating cheese doodles.