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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata (Read 14279 times)
Klick
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #17 - 11/10/11 at 18:58:19
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By the way, are we all in agreement that the line with 15. Nb5 is more dangerous than immediately 15. cxd6 by White


I`ve just thought of them as different systems. My impression is that whites idea of 15.cxd6 with Nf2, h3, Qc2, Rfc1 is quite good for white if he studies blacks speculative hacking attempts on the kingside carefully.

So I am just thinking of 15.Nb5 as another interesting idea for white which black must prepare for.
  
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OrangeCounty
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #16 - 11/09/11 at 22:04:15
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By the way, are we all in agreement that the line with 15. Nb5 is more dangerous than immediately 15. cxd6 by White (as Gallagher treats it, an obvious move, but I think I disagree)?  The upshot seems to be that White loses a tempo and Black plays ...b6 with it, which doesn't strike me as an improvement.  15. Nb5 Rf7 16. Ba5 b6 17. cxd6 cxd6 (elsewhere it's been pretty well annotated that 17...bxa5 is swallowing the hook) 18. Bb4 or 18. Be1, vs. 15. cxd6 cxd6 16. Nb5 Rf7, when White could, but probably shouldn't, play 17. Bb4 or 17. Be1.

I would think the exchange of wasted time favors White, as Black has a new weakness at c6 and (possibly more importantly) may soon need to move the a pawn as well.  If so, why does Gallagher dismiss the line we have/are beaten/beating to death in the other thread in favor of the simpler but less incisive 15. cxd6?
  
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OrangeCounty
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #15 - 11/07/11 at 17:18:31
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I think there's a long thread about that position somewhere around here.

Also apologies for our OT-ness on the Bayonet.
  
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #14 - 11/05/11 at 16:53:14
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GM Bannikas just played a game against Radjabov which featured 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.e4 d6 5.Nf3 O-O 6.Be2 e5 7.O-O Nc6 8.d5 Ne7 9.Ne1 Nd7 10.Nd3 f5 11.Bd2. 

It continued: 11...Nf6 12.f3 f4 13.c5 g5 14.Rc1 Ng6 15.Nb5 Rf7 16.Ba5 b6 17.cd6 cd6 18.Be1 a6 19.Nc3 a5 20.Nb5 Bf8 21.Rc3 g4 22.Qc2 gf3 23.Bf3 Ng4 24.Bf2 Nh4 25.Bg4 Bg4 26.Bh4 Qh4 27.Ne1 Qh5 28.Nf3 and they agreed to a draw.

21 or 22.Bf2 may have been an improvement for white.
  
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Oblonskij
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #13 - 11/03/11 at 17:50:46
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I meant that the growing popularity of ...Ne8 meant that you couldn't any longer play the Bayonet with limited time to study 25+ move complications. The 9. ...Nh5 12. Bf3 and 9. ...a5 10. bxa5 lines are possible to play without really knowing that much theory.
  
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OldGrizzly
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #12 - 11/03/11 at 08:55:03
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In the past, the assessment of 9...Ne8 in the Bayonet and 9.Nd2 line was bad. This has changed - at least parcially - when Black played ...dxc5 after the c5 push. There are only few lines which give headaches for the Black side. Therefore I'm interested to hear whether there is a clear refutation. 
I know that TopNotch was an ardent adherent... His answer would be very useful.
  
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OrangeCounty
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #11 - 11/02/11 at 16:34:32
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You're right, and I apologize for the merely flippant answer (although, as you note, the question wasn't directed at me anyway.  What I meant was that since the ...Ne8 lines of the Bayonet Variation are considered less critical - and better for White - than the main ...Nh5 lines, they should be considered "scary" for the player of the Black pieces anyway, regardless of new theoretical developments for White.

Not that I'm not interested to see what Oblonskij has -

But I don't seriously believe that the ...Ne8 Bayonet is going to make a comeback, especially given that the ...Nh5 lines seem to be holding up well (although Paulsen and Smyslov have some analysis in another post that is, at least, worth investigating for players of the White pieces).
  
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #10 - 11/01/11 at 16:40:08
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OrangeCounty wrote on 10/31/11 at 22:59:03:
Yeah, I sort of thought the ...Ne8 Bayonet had always been scary.

This is not satisfying. I'd like to hear more, especially from Oblonskij.
  
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OrangeCounty
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #9 - 10/31/11 at 22:59:03
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Yeah, I sort of thought the ...Ne8 Bayonet had always been scary.

On point: Gallagher's idea isn't wrong, but it isn't a necessity either.  Black is not lost after multiple moves, and ...Qb8 has the disadvantage of being visually passive.
  
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #8 - 10/29/11 at 11:42:59
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@Oblonskij
What do you mean especially when you say the Ne8 bayonet is starting to look a bit scary?
  
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #7 - 10/28/11 at 14:49:31
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David Vigorito mentions Roeder-Hebden and questions Roedens 23.Rc3?! 

According to chesslive.de 21...Qb8!? has been tried once since the Hebden game: Krush-Fedorowicz 1998 where the game continued with an atypical bishop maneouvre from black

22.a5 Be7 23.Na3 Bd8 24.Bb5 Bxb5 25.Qxb5 Bc7 26.Nc4 Rg7

  
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LeeRoth
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #6 - 10/30/10 at 17:11:26
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Here's another:

Krush-Fedorowicz, USA 1998

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6 5. Nf3 O-O 6. Be2 e5 7. O-O Nc6 8. d5 Ne7 9. Ne1 Nd7 10. Nd3 f5 11. Bd2 Nf6 12. f3 f4 13. c5 g5 14. Rc1 Ng6 15. cxd6
cxd6 16. Nb5 Rf7 17. Qc2 Ne8 18. a4 h5 19. Nf2 Bd7 20. h3 Bf8 21. Qb3 Qb8  22. a5 Be7 23. Na3 Bd8 24. Bb5 Bxb5 25. Qxb5 Bc7 26. Nc4 Rg7 27. a6 b6 28. Bb4 Qd8 29. Na3 Nh4 30. Qe2 g4 31. hxg4 b5 32. Nxb5 Bb6 33. Rc6 hxg4 34. fxg4 Rg6 35. Kh1 Rh6 36. Nh3 f3 37. Rxf3 Nxf3 38. Qxf3 Rf6 39. Qe2 Rb8 1/2-1/2

  
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Oblonskij
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #5 - 10/28/10 at 09:19:53
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Gallagher writes that Bf6 might save a tempo but is less flexible. Whatever that means.

  
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TonyRo
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #4 - 10/27/10 at 23:18:34
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Piket - Kasparov, Tilburg 1989 - not the same line I don't think.
  
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spagh3tti
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Re: Gallagher's line in the 11. Bd2 mar del plata
Reply #3 - 10/27/10 at 23:09:28
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I dunno if it is at all relevant to this line but I vaguely remember a Kasparov game where he played Qb8-a7 and had the Q work on the a7-g1 diagonal.
  
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