ChessPub Forum - Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann?

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Question: Name 2. Nf3 3. exd4 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann

Kings Knight Variation

2 (8.7%)

Apocalypse Variation

16 (69.6%)

Neo-Exchange Variation

3 (13.0%)

Indonesian Variation

2 (8.7%)

Total votes: 23

« Created by: George Jempty on: 03/30/12 at 16:31:28 »

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Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? (Read 36293 times)

MartinC God Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 2115 Joined: 07/24/06	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #15 - 03/31/12 at 09:09:03	Post Tools	Print Post
	And copying Morozevich often very far from healthy for less insanely talented players


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TN God Member Offline Posts: 3420 Joined: 11/07/08 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #14 - 03/31/12 at 06:49:56	Post Tools	Print Post
	George Jempty wrote on 03/30/12 at 22:59:21: kylemeister wrote on 03/30/12 at 21:46:27: Of course Black will presumably be trying to show (and presumably has a good chance of doing so) that this is an Exchange in which White has played a thematic advance (if a Knight move can be an advance) prematurely. Well it's gotten Morozevich's attention and that is good enough for me if not for you. If I recall correctly that was a rapid game in Amber, and Morozevich was losing until Bareev made a couple of blunders. So that game isn't the best advertisement for the line, which is probably one of White's better sidelines against the Caro-Kann.

	All our dreams come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
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Bresando Junior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing! Posts: 59 Location: Pavia, Italy Joined: 02/12/10 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #13 - 03/31/12 at 01:42:33	Post Tools	Print Post
	But wasn't it just a blindfold game? Anyway there's no reason to get angry, he just said that it's not clear whether this is an improved exchange variation or not. And this sort of "player x used it a couple of times" argument rater pointless, at move 4 almost everything has been played a couple of times by a respectable player. For example the "unimproved" exchange variation was good enough for Fischer...


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George Jempty Senior Member Offline Participant 1996 US Corres. Champ. Qualifying Rd. Posts: 305 Location: Carrollton, TX Joined: 03/29/09 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #12 - 03/30/12 at 22:59:21	Post Tools	Print Post
	kylemeister wrote on 03/30/12 at 21:46:27: Of course Black will presumably be trying to show (and presumably has a good chance of doing so) that this is an Exchange in which White has played a thematic advance (if a Knight move can be an advance) prematurely. Well it's gotten Morozevich's attention and that is good enough for me if not for you.


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MNb God Member Offline Rudolf Spielmann forever Posts: 10777 Location: Moengo Joined: 01/05/04 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #11 - 03/30/12 at 22:06:57	Post Tools	Print Post
	Stefan Buecker wrote on 03/30/12 at 18:42:23: Apparently it was Michael Goeller [= urusov] who introduced the name "Apocalypse Attack". If I'm not mistaken it's "Rajmunde Emanuel", who used to have a website on amongst others the Alchemy Variation. As I lost to him in a corr. game I know his real name, but after all these years I still don't know if I can reveal it .....

	The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged. GC Lichtenberg
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kylemeister God Member Offline Posts: 4989 Location: USA Joined: 10/24/05	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #10 - 03/30/12 at 21:46:27	Post Tools	Print Post
	Of course Black will presumably be trying to show (and presumably has a good chance of doing so) that this is an Exchange in which White has played a thematic advance (if a Knight move can be an advance) prematurely.


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TN God Member Offline Posts: 3420 Joined: 11/07/08 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #9 - 03/30/12 at 21:29:59	Post Tools	Print Post
	BPaulsen wrote on 03/30/12 at 18:48:10: I like the colorful name. Regardless of what others may call it I'll stick with "Apocalypse Attack". Because when I get to defend against it, I can say I staved off the apocalypse. I also like the name 'Apocalypse Attack'.

	All our dreams come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
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George Jempty Senior Member Offline Participant 1996 US Corres. Champ. Qualifying Rd. Posts: 305 Location: Carrollton, TX Joined: 03/29/09 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #8 - 03/30/12 at 20:57:04	Post Tools	Print Post
	From the poll results so far it looks like the name "Apocalypse" is sticking. Anyway, I know what I'm trying to acheive when I play it: an improved exchange variation where Black has difficulty developing ...Bf5 or ...Bg4


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BPaulsen God Member Offline I Love Light Squares! Posts: 1702 Location: Anaheim, CA, USA Joined: 11/02/08 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #7 - 03/30/12 at 18:48:10	Post Tools	Print Post
	I like the colorful name. Regardless of what others may call it I'll stick with "Apocalypse Attack". Because when I get to defend against it, I can say I staved off the apocalypse.

	2288 USCF, 2186 FIDE. FIDE based on just 27 games.
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Stefan Buecker God Member Offline Posts: 1386 Location: Germany Joined: 02/11/09 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #6 - 03/30/12 at 18:42:23	Post Tools	Print Post
	Apparently it was Michael Goeller [= urusov] who introduced the name "Apocalypse Attack". George Jempty wrote on 03/30/12 at 14:05:48: The second earliest game I find in chesslive.de was played by an Indonesian player in the Nice Olympiad in 1974. Whatever board he played on he did quite respectably, with 7 wins, 2 draws and 4 losses. Instead of Indonesian Variation, wouldn't the name of the player be better: Monang-Sinulingga Variation? And you chose the second earliest game, probably because the game was "Olympic", I guess. However, the oldest game wasn't too bad either. I like the last move: Download game in pgn format


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George Jempty Senior Member Offline Participant 1996 US Corres. Champ. Qualifying Rd. Posts: 305 Location: Carrollton, TX Joined: 03/29/09 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #5 - 03/30/12 at 16:31:28	Post Tools	Print Post
	Maybe I should have had this poll all along. Have added a couple of options based on a suggestion and my research. Please try not to allow the ordering affect your vote: research shows the last option(s) get considered the least. Nevertheless I put my own ideas as the last 2 so as to try to not bias results in favor of them.


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Zwischenzugzwang Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing & chess pubs! Posts: 380 Location: Zotzenbach Joined: 06/14/11 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #4 - 03/30/12 at 16:13:57	Post Tools	Print Post
	TalJechin wrote on 03/30/12 at 15:04:12: Thankfully we don't have any 1-16 Pawn's variations yet... Just have a look at the d-Pawn Specials ...

	What do people mean when they say "Chess is the pawn of the soul"?
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TalJechin God Member Offline There is no secret ingredient. Posts: 2892 Location: Malmö Joined: 08/12/04 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #3 - 03/30/12 at 15:04:12	Post Tools	Print Post
	And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse (http://bible.cc/revelation/19-11.htm) This has always seemed a good name to me. Though on the "Frankenstein-Dracula" I'd agree, but otherwise I like colourful names for variations, if it's not completely artificial like the F-D. And btw, all these 1-4 Knight's variations are even sillier - there are always four knights on the board to start with. Thankfully we don't have any 1-16 Pawn's variations yet...


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Zwischenzugzwang Senior Member Offline I Love ChessPublishing & chess pubs! Posts: 380 Location: Zotzenbach Joined: 06/14/11 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #2 - 03/30/12 at 14:59:04	Post Tools	Print Post
	What about "One Knight Variation" in analogy to the "Two Knights Variation" 1.e4 c6 2.Nc3 d5 3.Nf3, or "King's Knight Variation"? I totally agree with you, George, that all this "Frankenstein-Dracula-Halloween"-terminology sounds rather stupid.

	What do people mean when they say "Chess is the pawn of the soul"?
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George Jempty Senior Member Offline Participant 1996 US Corres. Champ. Qualifying Rd. Posts: 305 Location: Carrollton, TX Joined: 03/29/09 Gender:	Re: Name for 2. Nf3 3. exd5 and 4. Ne5 vs. Caro Kann? Reply #1 - 03/30/12 at 14:05:48	Post Tools	Print Post
	The second earliest game I find in chesslive.de was played by an Indonesian player in the Nice Olympiad in 1974. Whatever board he played on he did quite respectably, with 7 wins, 2 draws and 4 losses. So if not "Neo-Exchange" then I propose "Indonesian" variation. I know it is personal preference but I hate all the names such as "Frankenstein-Dracula", "Halloween Gambit" and this is why I don't like "Apocalypse" variation.


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