Poll
Poll Question: What do you think about From's Gambit, 1.f4 e5?
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Sound    
  10 (17.2%)
So messy that it's playable    
  15 (25.9%)
Objectively struggling against best play    
  22 (37.9%)
Unsound    
  7 (12.1%)
Dead    
  4 (6.9%)




Total votes: 58
« Created by: CraigEvans on: 03/20/06 at 09:46:13 »
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) From's Gambit - Current Opinion (Read 33261 times)
Dragonslayer
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #9 - 03/31/06 at 15:34:35
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As far as İ know the line 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 g5 5.d4 g4 6.Ne5 is a sterile equality after 6...Bxe5 7.dxe5 Qxd1 8.Kxd1.

1.f4 d6 2.e4 Nf6 3.Nc3 d5!? looks interesting. İt reminds me of the Dutch line 1.Nf3 f5 2.d3.
İf White wants to aim for the Bishops gambit he should choose 1.f4 d6 2.e4 and if 2...e5 then 3.Bc4.

Would like to think what you think of the main line From which is still critical.
  
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Uberdecker
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #8 - 03/31/06 at 14:35:12
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[quote author=Dragonslayer link=1142847973/0#6 date=1143216716]
After 1.f4 d6 2.e4 Nf6 White has 3.Nc3 with either a good King's Gambit (3...e5) a good Grand Prix attack (3...c5) or a mainline Pirc (3...g6 4.d4).
[/quote]

Actually the transposition to Pirc/Czech/Lion etc  is perhaps not compulsory. Black may also have 3. ...d5!? ; 4. e5 d4 ; 5. Ktce2 (5. ef dc ; 6. fg cd+ ; 7. Bxd2 Bxg7 Χ-f4) Ktd5 ; 6. Ktxd4 Ktxf4 ; 7. Ktgf3 c5!?
  
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Uberdecker
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #7 - 03/24/06 at 17:09:55
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[quote author=Dragonslayer link=1142847973/0#6 date=1143216716]
After 1.f4 d6 2.Nf3 e5 White can still enter the King's Gambit with 3.e4 which alomst forces Black to play the Fischer defence with 3...exf4. Uberdeker's line 3.fxe5 g5!? transposes to the line 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.Nf3 g5!? [/quote]

Being forced to play the Fischer Defence is fine by me! Also note that Black has avoided the King's Bishop Gambit which is probably White's most reasonable try (cf. "The Fascinating King's Gambit in the 1. e4 e5 section).

The idea of my offhand suggestion 1. f4 d6 ; 2. Ktf3 e5 ; 3. fe g5 ; 4. ed g4 was to [i]avoid [/i] transposition to the From, but White can play 5. Kte5 when Black may have nothing better than 5. ...Bxd6 and 6. d4 transposes anyway. What is the current status of 1. f4 e5 ; 2. fe d6 ; 3. ed Bxd6 ; 4. Ktf3 g5 ; 5. d4 g4 ; 6. Kte5 ? If it's uncritical, there may actually be some point to this rubbish!
  
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Dragonslayer
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #6 - 03/24/06 at 16:11:56
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I do not have Taylor's book but IMO the From is playable.

After 1.f4 d6 2.e4 Nf6 White has 3.Nc3 with either a good King's Gambit (3...e5) a good Grand Prix attack (3...c5) or a mainline Pirc (3...g6 4.d4).
After 1.f4 d6 2.Nf3 e5 White can still enter the King's Gambit with 3.e4 which alomst forces Black to play the Fischer defence with 3...exf4. Uberdeker's line 3.fxe5 g5!? transposes to the line 1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.Nf3 g5!? This is probably ok for Black. According to Danish cc-GM Ove Ekebjærg White's best is the Polerio style sacrifice 4.e4 g4 5.Bc4 gxf3 6.Qxf3.

In the main line From:
1.f4 e5 2.fxe5 d6 3.exd6 Bxd6 4.Nf3 g5 5.g3 g4 6.Nh4 Ne7 7.e4!? Ng6 8.Nf5 Bxf5 9.exf5 Ne5 10.Bg2 Nbc6 11.0-0 looks dangerous for White, but with accurate play he should have the better chances.

4...Nf6 seems the better choice. After 5.d4 Black can choose between a dead even game after 5...0-0 6.Bg5 Re8 7.Qd3 Nc6 8.a3 (or 8.c3) h6 9.Bxf6 Qxf6 10.e4 Bf5 11.Nc3. Black wins the pawn on e4 with Qe7 or Qg6.
More complicated is 5...Ng4 6.Qd3! c5 7.Qe4+ Be6 8.Ng5 Bxh2
and here White must decide between the draw with 9.Rxh2 Nxh2 10.Nxe6 fxe6 11.Qxe6+ Qe7 12.Qc8+ Qd8!=
or playing for more with 9.Nxe6 Qh4+! 10.Kd2 fxe6 11.Rxh2 (11.Qxe6+ Kd8 is also unclear) 11...Qg5+ 12.e3 Nxh2 13.Qxe6+ Kd8 14.Qd6+ Nd7 15.Qxh2 which is very unclear.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #5 - 03/23/06 at 19:07:18
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Quote:
1. f4 d6 ; 2. Ktf3 (2. e4 Ktf6 ; 3. e5 Ktd5 ; 4. d4 Bf5 is sideline of the Alekhine which is already in my repertoire since I sometimes play 1. e4 d6) e5 ; 3. de g5 ; 4. dc g4 ; 5. dc Qxc7 ; 6. Ktd4 Bd6 
Black is two pawns down but the dark squares around the White King look rather weak.


Does look interesting and if nothing else a useful blitz weapon.  I believe we've also discussed here on the forum that 1.f4 d6 2.Nf3 Bg4 is a fairly solid defence for Black.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #4 - 03/23/06 at 18:32:10
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Dear all,

  I'm a bit alarmed at the general view on a line I instinctively considered to be sound. It's perhaps time I kicked it out of my repertoire.
I was thinking maybe a deferred version is playable :
1. f4 d6 ; 2. Ktf3 (2. e4 Ktf6 ; 3. e5 Ktd5 ; 4. d4 Bf5 is sideline of the Alekhine which is already in my repertoire since I sometimes play 1. e4 d6) e5 ; 3. fe g5 ; 4. ed g4 ; 5. dc Qxc7 ; 6. Ktd4 Bd6
Black is two pawns down but the dark squares around the White King look rather weak.
The whole thing is probably highly dubious, but it might appeal to some BDG fanatics if they ever stick their heads out of the "-d pawn specials" section!

                                                     Looking forward to hearing what you think of this junk,
                                                                                                   Hubert
« Last Edit: 03/23/06 at 20:51:04 by Uberdecker »  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #3 - 03/21/06 at 06:12:50
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i think its a pretty good gambit relative to other black gambits. my problem with it is that unlike most gambits, your opponent will always have more experience against it than you have playing it.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #2 - 03/20/06 at 18:26:13
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I'd say 'shaky' if not, very dubious however putting that aside Black has to be prepared against the next move 2. e4 for all those King's Gambiteers.
  
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Re: From's Gambit - Current Opinion
Reply #1 - 03/20/06 at 11:21:17
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CraigEvans wrote on 03/20/06 at 09:46:13:
... especially since Tim Taylor's excellent book on the opening.



In my point of view,From Gambit analysis are the worse chapter in Tim Taylor's book, so don't rely to much on this book for f4 e5. For example, why is there nothing on the variation 4...Bg4, and so much  information on the variation 4...Nf6 and 5...Ng4  ????
  
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CraigEvans
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From's Gambit - Current Opinion
03/20/06 at 09:46:13
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At Uberdecker's request on another thread, I thought it might be good to start a new thread on this exceptionally sharp gambit, and to combine it with a poll given the enermous amount of interest in the Bird's Opening recently on this forum (and elsewhere), especially since Tim Taylor's excellent book on the opening.

Certainly, in his book, he makes a good case for Lasker's 4...g5 looking shaky - I have played the line myself and agree that it's predicated on a few traps which, once avoided, leave black with little for his investment. I haven't had enough time to check through the Mestel (4...Nf6, 5...Ng4!?) line much, but I am much less convinced by his analysis here - however, objectively I feel that black should not be able to get away with giving up both central pawns solely because white has pushed his f-pawn.
  

"Give a man a pawn, and he'll smell a rat. Give a man a piece, and he'll smell a patzer." - Me.

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