Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 
Topic Tools
Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) C07-C09: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3 (Read 10089 times)
SJplayer
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 4
Joined: 05/03/07
Re: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3
Reply #4 - 05/07/07 at 22:43:52
Post Tools
Yes, Nc3 gives black a tempo but still it's according to the strategy of the position. Anyway I like the position.

Black can not really pressure Nc3 with moves like Nfd5 or Qa5 since he will either have to take with the bishop which is really dubious or have to move the bishop back after bxc which I think looks fine for white. 

A question, is trading white square color bishop ok for white. For instance here is a bad example after 
the further moves 9.Bd3 0-0 10.0-0 Be7 11.a3 b6 12.Re1 a5 13.Be3 Ba6 

It looks a bit weird after Bx6, Rxa6 but what do you think?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
kylemeister
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 4989
Location: USA
Joined: 10/24/05
Re: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3
Reply #3 - 05/07/07 at 22:07:00
Post Tools
It's playable (I recall the English GM James Plaskett playing it a few times) but tends to lead to a standard IQP position where White is a tempo down compared to the normal case.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SJplayer
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 4
Joined: 05/03/07
Re: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3
Reply #2 - 05/07/07 at 20:36:52
Post Tools
Ok here is the position after 4...Nc6 5.c3 cxd4 6.cxd dxe4 7.Nxe4 


On 7...Bb4+ I don't think I want to trade bishops here so 8.Nc3 but this gives him a tempo for free. Still I think this is the line I have to play, Bd2 feels unconsistent.


After 8...Nf6 I can develop with 9.Bd3 and I will chase away the bishop with a3.

Any comments on this line?
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
dom
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 908
Location: Toulouse
Joined: 01/11/03
Gender: Male
Re: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3
Reply #1 - 05/07/07 at 16:59:35
Post Tools
Welcome on French forum  Smiley
As you found it, no way exists to "force" a Korchnoi gambit position as White after c5 (the "open" main line)...and Bb5 is often the better move for White. Another point is Black or White often looses a tempo.
After 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3  Black need an useful move:
A) 4...Nf6 5.e5 Nfd7 run to Korchnoi's gambit where White as space advantage
B) 4..cxd4 5.exd5 Qxd5 (5...exd5 6.Nxd4 and White has already his pieces on good squares) 6.Bc4 is the main line .. and you 'll note White castles quickly. The pawn less (d4) is quickly recovered (usually Nb3-Nxd4)
C) 4..Qb6 5.c3 Nc6 (5...Nf6 6.e5 see A) 6.exd5! (and not 6.e5?! cxd4!  or Bd7 with transposition to Nun's gambit) exd5 7.Bd3 (better to castle and threaten Re1 early) cxd4 (7...c4 Bc2 and an easy game for White with b3 in some moves) 8.cxd4 Nxd4 9.oo! a gambit will Black has many problems (king safety, d5 isolated pawn)
D) 4...Nc6 5.c3 if you want to transpose to C but 5.Bb5 a6! 6.Bxc6+ bxc6 7.c3!? is interesting too, with play for White on dark squares. Rohde-Gulko
or 5.exd5 leading to lines with the isolated pawn
E) 4...a6 (I noticed Korchnoi,Gurevich like to play this move which is start of system where Black plays a6-b5-c4-d5 pawn structure) 5.dxc5! Bxc5 and now White has two plans

E1) 6. Nb3 Bb6 7.exd5 exd5 8.Bg5 Nf6 and now 9.Qe2+ Socko-Kiriakov,Saint Vincent 2005 with a sharp game. In the position with isolated pawn on d5, it's important not to give Black active play (for example: Bb6 and Nf6-Ne4) and sometimes Bb5 is used to entice g8 knight moving on e7 instead of good f6 square)

E2) 6.Bd3 Nc6 7.oo (7.c3 Nf6 8.Qe2 Qc7 9.oo Popovic-Kiriakov,Internet playchess.com 2006 and 10.Nb3 Litwak-Kiriakov,Internet playchess.com 2004 ) Nf6 8.Qe2 Qc7 9.h3 Renet-Gallagher,Clichy 1989 or 8...Nb4 9.e5 Nd7 10.Nb3 and small advantage to White
  

“Learn from the mistakes of others. You can never live long enough to make them all yourself.”  - Groucho Marx
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
SJplayer
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 4
Joined: 05/03/07
C07-C09: 1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3
05/05/07 at 12:14:34
Post Tools
Hi, this is my first post in your forums!

1.e4 e6 2.d4 d5 3.Nd2 c5 4.Ngf3

I'm new to the tarrasch defence and so far I have been playing blitz games with 4.Ngf3 hoping it will transpose into the Korchnoi gambit with 4...Nf6 5.e5 or 4...Nc6 5.c3 I'm hoping to play it in a tournament soon, so I'm looking for some helpfull comments.
I have looked some in databases and exd is often played. Maybe someone could give me a quick briefing on the different alternatives for white and the plan behind each one. When do you favourably play exd for example? After 4...Nc6 5.Bb5 is also an alternative, what is the plan with this move. In some lines you can get an isolated queen pawn and all sorts structures so this is a pretty critical position for deciding what to play.

Thank you for the help. I hope to be able to contribute in forums in the future!
« Last Edit: 07/30/11 at 14:46:05 by dom »  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 [2] 
Topic Tools
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo