Quote:

I think 13.Ne4 is worth investigating - what is your recommendation for Black against this move?

Dear TGO,
It's good to see you working hard to find an advantage against the Caro-Kann, and thank you for sharing your efforts here. Four your personal satisfaction, do make sure to balance your computer analysis with your own and to enjoy OTB games, which can help relativize such strong views as "11. Bf4 is a draw". As for testing the potential of the immediate 11. Bd2, don't forget the straightforward plan of ...0-0 followed by ...c5, against which some strong (human) players find it hard to show an advantage, as in the following game (Pap - Czarnota, Avoine 2008) :

1. e4 c6 2. d4 d5 3. Nd2 dxe4 4. Nxe4 Bf5 5. Ng3 Bg6 6. h4 h6 7. Nf3 Nd7 8. h5 Bh7 9. Bd3 Bxd3 10. Qxd3 e6 11. Bd2 Ngf6 12. O-O-O Be7 13. Kb1 O-O 14. Ne4 c5 15. dxc5 Nxc5 16. Nxf6+ Bxf6 17. Qxd8 Rfxd8 18. Be3 Na4 19. Bd4 Bxd4 20. Rxd4 Rxd4 1/2-1/2

Can anybody strenghthen this 11. Bd2 line for White ?

this might have been what I was looking for in the 3...c5 line thank you!

my analysis currently shows that 11. Bf4 is drawn (white can't get any advantage with current theory, and as far as I know top games show this trend also)

11. Bd2 seems to have much more potential so I am switching to that.

I am quite sure that 4... Nc6 is best (it's supported by statistics and  deep computer analysis it is also the reccomendation of IM Andrew Martin)

well further analysis has shown that you get a more or less drawn endgame, there are some shots for white still though 


and pumi try the move, lol much less theory and quite practical! ( I never did like karpov, I believe 3..c5 is Botvinik's move)


ps: anyone has anything to say about my  original question? ( I recall there was quite a groundbreaking game by Carlsen againts kamsky in the main line sacing a pawn to open lines to the king)

3..c5 isn't refuted.

But I hate the move. I still play Karpov's plan with 3..Bf5 with good results.

I am a regular caro kann player and have explored this opening's theory quite well. But always frow the black side, lately when I was playing in the engine room at playchess and done analysis with Rybka 3 I have been trying to prove some kind of advantage for white in the main lines but there just does not seem to be any!

the main Bf4 capablanca line seems to be completly drawn or even slightly better for black (which I like from a caro kann player's perspective, but would like to find some advantage if there is any to be found)

initial analysis looked like the main line has no advantage for white :

1. e4  c6 2. d4 d5 3. Nd2 dxe4 4. Nxe4 Bf5 5. Ng3 Bg6 6. h4 h6 7. Nf3 Nd7 8. h5 Bh7 9. Bd3 Bxd3 10. Qxd3 e6 11. Bf4 Qa5+ 12. Bd2 Bb4 13. c3 Be7 14. c4 Qc7 15. O-O-O Ngf6 16. Kb1 O-O

now there are many lines but I have not found any advantage (note that I am not saying this is the best line but it is curent theory as far as I know)

My analysis currently shows that the Bd2 line is superior to Bf4   

my question is could it be that theory is wrong in these lines? And what is the best hope for an advantage? (my results seem to show that white can't hope for any advantage and that Bd2 is best (e5 can also be played but I don't like those positions so I trying to find something here)