lg wrote on 01/26/10 at 13:14:48:
Keano wrote on 01/26/10 at 12:53:27:
I think Marin recently played the bizarre-looking 9...Re8!? if I´m not mistaken - the idea seems similar (wait for Nf3 to play ...Bg4, if not prepare some central action with ...e5)
Well, these two ideas: 9....Bf5 and 9...Re8 seem worth analising
this also means that Marin might do a CBM article on this variation
Yes, I also noticed the Marin game. Athough in general I'm an admirer of the Marin "brand", I suspect that 9...Re8 will prove to be dead-end since, as waiting moves go, it is actually quite committal!
I am suspicious of it for these reasons:
a) White can continue to delay Nf3, playing sensible waiting moves (Be2, h3) which are likely to be at least as useful than Re8;
b) if Black wants to switch to ...e5 plans, then ...Re8 will be a complete waste of a tempo after dxe5, dxe5, Qxd8, Rxd8;
c) Even if Black somehow avoids an exchange of queens on d8 after playing ...e5 (e.g. by playing ...Bd7 first), White can answer with d5 if he wants, after which the rook on e8 might well be misplaced (perhaps better on f8, supporting ...f5).
d) ...Re8 does not fit in well with the ...f5 plan, so that is another Black option that ...Re8 more or less rules out.
Therefore I would argue that ...Re8 is the opposite of flexible and its value depends entirely on White naively playing Nf3, allowing ...Bg4, when Black has gained a tempo on the 9...Bf5 line (always assuming that Re8 is useful in the "old-style" structure (Black pawn on d5, White pawns on d4 and c5).
Still, it's early days in the life of these ideas, so let's hope we soon have some more games to study, so that any conclusions can be more concrete than the above.
Incidentally, Marin's opponent allowed ...Bg4 but did not push c4-c5:
[Event "Cto. Espańa CECLUB 1Ş División B"]
[Site "Barbera del Valles (ESP)"]
[Date "2009.08.11"]
[Round "1.1"]
[White "Almagro Llanas, Pablo"]
[Black "Marin, Mihail"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "B03"]
[WhiteElo "2481"]
[BlackElo "2583"]
[PlyCount "90"]
[EventDate "2009.08.11"]
[EventRounds "3"]
[EventCountry "ESP"]
[Source "Arranz, Pablo"]
[SourceDate "2009.08.11"]
[WhiteTeam "Afronta Consultoría V. Atocha"]
[BlackTeam "Foment Martinenc"]
[WhiteTeamCountry "ESP"]
[BlackTeamCountry "ESP"]
1. e4 Nf6 2. e5 Nd5 3. d4 d6 4. c4 Nb6 5. exd6 cxd6 6. Nc3 g6 7. Be3 Bg7 8. Rc1
O-O 9. b3 Re8 10. Nf3 Bg4 11. Be2 d5 12. h3 Bxf3 13. Bxf3 e6 14. O-O Nc6 15.
cxd5 exd5 16. Qd3 a6 17. Na4 Nxa4 18. bxa4 Ne7 19. Qb3 b6 20. Bg5 Ra7 21. Rfe1
h6 22. Bxd5 hxg5 23. Bxf7+ Kh7 24. Bxe8 Qxe8 25. Qxb6 Qd7 26. Red1 Nd5 27. Qc6
Qf7 28. Rc5 Nf4 29. Rxg5 Bxd4 30. Kh1 Rc7 31. Qf3 Rc3 32. Qe4 Bxf2 33. Rf1 Re3
34. Qc6 Re1 35. Rxe1 Bxe1 36. Qxa6 Qe7 37. Rb5 Kh6 38. Rb1 Qe3 39. Qc8 Bc3 40.
Qg4 Nh5 41. Qf3 Qe5 42. Qf8+ Kh7 43. Qf7+ Kh6 44. Qf8+ Kh7 45. Qf7+ Kh6 1/2-1/2