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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Best openings in must win situations? (Read 13558 times)
Markovich
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #26 - 02/09/09 at 15:54:53
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Smyslov_Fan wrote on 02/03/09 at 06:10:00:
I just read Lee Roth's suggestion of playing the Benoni as Black.  I like that choice!  Statistically, White wins a large percent of the games, but at least a draw is the least likely result!  Also, White would probably want to stay away from the Aronin-Taimanov (Flick-Knife) Variation, which would suit Black just fine.

As a general rule, I agree that Black should strive to keep the pieces on the board and seek an unbalanced position which may be considered slightly better for White, but which is dynamically and statically complex.  Then again, be true to yourself.  If you are an endgame wiz, don't be afraid to enter the endgame, but don't rush it.

As Joe Jackson once said, "Logical advice leaves you in a whirl."


I think that if White must draw and doesn't care about the win, he might well be advised meet the Benoni with e3 rather than d5.
  

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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #25 - 02/09/09 at 14:53:56
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Depending on if I know my opponent, I would sometimes choose something I know they would most likely have a problem with.    

Otherwise, if I had to play for a win as white, I would start out with 1.c4..   I've always had unusual games with that first move and it usually gets my creativeness going right away.  Normally I play 1.e4 in every game but most peeps know a good drawing line with 1.... e5.  So that cant be a guaranteed win for me.

As black I play sicilian scheveningen against 1.e4  and straight tarrasch against 1.d4.

regards - Rongmuvs
  
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #24 - 02/03/09 at 11:23:08
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I was going to post this in the Corus 2009 thread but saw this thread and decided to post here. I thought Corus 2009 threw up an interesting test of this thread's question. Going into the final round, we had 6 co-leaders. Assuming all wanted to win, what openings would they play?

Round 13 (February 1, 2009) 
Radjabov, Teimour - Stellwagen, Daniël ˝-˝ 24 B83 Sicilian Scheveningen 
Dominguez Perez, Leinier - Karjakin, Sergey 0-1 41 B90 Sicilian Najdorf Variation 
Kamsky, Gata - Movsesian, Sergei ˝-˝ 47 B83 Sicilian Scheveningen 
Wang Yue - Carlsen, Magnus 1-0 67 D45 Anti-Meran Variations 
Smeets, Jan - Aronian, Levon ˝-˝ 22 B42 Sicilian Paulsen 
Adams, Michael - Van Wely, Loek ˝-˝ 35 B84 Sicilian Scheveningen 
Morozevich, Alexander - Ivanchuk, Vassily 1-0 45 D10 Slav Defence 

Radjabov played 1 e4 and was taken into a sicilian.
Dominguez played 1 e4 and Karjakin played a Najdorf.
Movsesian played Schevy.
Aronian played a Paulsen.
Carlsen played a Slav/semi-Slav?

Interesting?

In Corus B,

Round 13 (February 1, 2009) 
Caruana, Fabiano - Short, Nigel D 1-0 67 E06 Catalan 
Motylev, Alexander - Kasimdzhanov, Rustam 1-0 75 B07 Pirc Defence 
Efimenko, Zahar - Volokitin, Andrei 1-0 40 B42 Sicilian Paulsen 

Caruana played the flavour opening of the month, the Catalan which Short had to defend
Kazimzhanov played the Pirc.
Volokitin played the Paulsen.

Of course these only applied at >2600 GM level and not to mere mortals like us
  

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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #23 - 02/03/09 at 06:10:00
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I just read Lee Roth's suggestion of playing the Benoni as Black.  I like that choice!  Statistically, White wins a large percent of the games, but at least a draw is the least likely result!  Also, White would probably want to stay away from the Aronin-Taimanov (Flick-Knife) Variation, which would suit Black just fine.

As a general rule, I agree that Black should strive to keep the pieces on the board and seek an unbalanced position which may be considered slightly better for White, but which is dynamically and statically complex.  Then again, be true to yourself.  If you are an endgame wiz, don't be afraid to enter the endgame, but don't rush it.

As Joe Jackson once said, "Logical advice leaves you in a whirl."
  
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Smyslov_Fan
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #22 - 02/03/09 at 06:01:07
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Depending on the time control, strength of opposition (relative and absolute), and any number of other circumstances....

As Black, if I absolutely had to win against a player who I had never faced before but was similarly rated, I would play my best line.  For me, that's probably the French, but could be a Sicilian or even a Caro-Kann (as long as White also needs the win).  If White only wants a draw, I probably would not play the Sicilian!

Against 1.d4, I would play... my best line, which is probably the Slav.  If my opponent needed only a draw, I might be tempted to play something not quite main-line such as the QGD Chigorin.  
  
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #21 - 01/31/09 at 18:55:33
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So, perhaps the idea that one has a must win as a black, and it is simply a matter of choosing the right opening, should be seen as a bit of a goof.


The whole thing got me to thinking on the idea that the game of chess is fundamentally flawed in that one side is inherently better at the onset than the other.  Most remarkable that this flaw, which would kill any other game (such as Monopoly or Poker), has been made into a strength.


Every other game I can think of is very concerned with creating equal playing field and egalitarian opportunities for competition.  Chess admits one side has an advantage at the onset, does nothing to mitigate this inequity, and manages to survive (flourish?).



If you have to win as Black, play tough and hope for errors on the part of your opponent that allow you to do so.  Be prepared and ready to exploit your opponent's oversights.


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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #20 - 01/31/09 at 18:27:48
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TN wrote on 01/31/09 at 07:38:51:
If a player is in a must-win situation as Black, and his opponent plays the Alapin, then in my view 2...d5 3.ed5 Qd5 4.d4 Nf6 5.Nf3 Bg4 offers Black a more unbalanced game than 2...d6. Although 2...d6 can lead to symmetrical sorts of positions, they do have the advantage of encouraging White (who has a space advantage in the centre) to overpress in some cases, particularly if he is higher-rated.

Some lines of the 2...Nf6 3.e5 Nd5 Alapin are considered notoriously drawish, but in my opinion Black has sensible ways of avoiding them, some of which are covered in Kolev's 'The Easiest Sicilian'. Another example: 4.Nf3 Nc6 5.Bc4 Nb6 6.Bb3 is best met by the uncompromising 6...c4 if Black is in a must-win situation.


I wouldn't think that the line with 2...d5 and 5...Bg4 is a good way for Black in this sense, because of White playing Be2, 0-0, h3, Be3 and retaking on d4 with the Knight.  (Incidentally, there was a time around the mid-90s when that line was considered by the Informant folks to be slightly better for White, but not surprisingly they later changed their view to "=".)  Black can take on d4 earlier, but that gives White some added possibilities and far as I know should be slightly better for him, as well as probably not good at generating winning chances for Black if White knows what he's doing.

I don't know what Kolev says, but I would think that perhaps 2...Nf6 3. e5 Nd5 4. d4 (4. Nf3 could well transpose to one of the lines I'm talking about) cd 5. Nf3 e6 6. cd d6 is the way to go (for one thing, 7. a3 used to be considered good for White there, but times have changed) ...despite the fact that it can transpose to an old main line with which a Dutch IM lost in 18 moves as Black today    Smiley
  
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #19 - 01/31/09 at 13:53:33
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kylemeister wrote on 01/31/09 at 06:11:31:
Perhaps, but I'm not sure what Black should do after 3. d4 Nf6 4. Bd3.  I recall an old main line there which results in a symmetrical sort of position with an edge for White.  Maybe Judit didn't have a much better idea recently against Godena ...


4...cxd4 5.cxd4 g6 6.Nc3 Bg7 7.Nf3 0-0 8.h3 Nc6 9.0-0 and now not ...e5 indeed, but Nd7 like Schmittdiel-Canfell, 1991. Look, I know that this is risky and I know White won, but I think Black's play can be improved.
  

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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #18 - 01/31/09 at 13:02:40
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when the top players need a draw with white vs sicilian they seem to just play their normal game rather than use alapin c3, I am thinking of Short v Karpov or Anand v Kramnik


I dont think c3 dries up the game that much and there are linesin open sicilian  e.g. in poson pawn where white can force a draw which would restrict black's choice of variation..
  
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #17 - 01/31/09 at 07:38:51
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If a player is in a must-win situation as Black, and his opponent plays the Alapin, then in my view 2...d5 3.ed5 Qd5 4.d4 Nf6 5.Nf3 Bg4 offers Black a more unbalanced game than 2...d6. Although 2...d6 can lead to symmetrical sorts of positions, they do have the advantage of encouraging White (who has a space advantage in the centre) to overpress in some cases, particularly if he is higher-rated.

Some lines of the 2...Nf6 3.e5 Nd5 Alapin are considered notoriously drawish, but in my opinion Black has sensible ways of avoiding them, some of which are covered in Kolev's 'The Easiest Sicilian'. Another example: 4.Nf3 Nc6 5.Bc4 Nb6 6.Bb3 is best met by the uncompromising 6...c4 if Black is in a must-win situation.
  

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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #16 - 01/31/09 at 06:11:31
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Perhaps, but I'm not sure what Black should do after 3. d4 Nf6 4. Bd3.  I recall an old main line there which results in a symmetrical sort of position with an edge for White.  Maybe Judit didn't have a much better idea recently against Godena ...
  
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #15 - 01/31/09 at 05:11:06
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kylemeister wrote on 01/30/09 at 18:55:20:
I suppose the traditional answer for 1. d4 is the Dutch.
For 1. e4 the answer seems to be harder (thinking of certain lines White can play in the c3 Sicilian and Four Knights for example) ...


If Black must win than (s)he may try 1.e4 c5 2.c3 d6. It's riskier and less solid, but that's what Black wants, isn't it?
  

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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #14 - 01/31/09 at 03:54:44
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I always found it intersting that Kasparov opted for a slow build-up in order to keep pieces on the board, while Kramnik, when faced with the same situation, played 1.e4 and a sharp line against Leko's Caro-Kann.  Perhaps these approaches were based on familiarity and knowledge of the opponent and what would be most uncomfortable for him?  In any event, those both as White.  As Black in a must win, I'd go Benoni or Sicilian. 
  
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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #13 - 01/31/09 at 01:15:42
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Against  1.d4  I think 1..f5 dutch Leningrad.
Against  1.e4  I go for the Pirc  

Both these defences leads to a fight. Although they pose some risks for black they also give winning chances.

But I agree with earlier posts that other skills and how much you know an opening also plays a very important role to get winning chances.

If we talk about white it is interesting to note that Kasparov chosed 1.c4 against Karpov in his must winning game in the world championship 1987 (?). Just a little strange he didnt do the same against Kramnik instead of banging his head into the Berlin Wall.
  

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Re: Best openings in must win situations?
Reply #12 - 01/31/09 at 00:10:38
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Interesting question.   
I too would agree on the Dutch and answer 1.c4 and 1.Nf3 with 1...f5 too.
Against 1.e4 I think the Sicilian and against 2.Nf3 either 2...e6 or 2...Nc6 avoiding 2...d6 3.Bb5+.
As White I think one could go with the non-forcing openings but there is also the serve and volley method if one is well booked up.
As others have pointed out there are many considerations to take into account so of course there is no sure fire formula.  I would add, however obvious it may be, that being a good endgame player greatly increases one's chances of scoring the whole point (or for saving the half point if you've pushed too hard trying to win!).
  
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