whatteaux wrote on 03/10/11 at 07:27:59:

That's the crux of this method. On chess.com there are a lot of people with really absurd ratings (now the corrected them a bit - but there were people with 3.200!). How can that be? Are they cheating? I say "NO!" within the above formula (which is the same for chess.com), because they surely analyse their openings well with books, databases and the comp (if the position is known, it should be allowed!), analysis sample games ("might be variation"), make a tree of them and then play their moves seemingly without the comp. Once they are beyond the opening with a stable plus, they don't need the comp assistance anymore.

Despite I play on chess.com, too (mostly Thematic Tourneys - to test the chesspub.variations!) I think that it's much easier to simply allow all assistance. There is a lot of discussion about cheating - but where does opening analysis end (what if I already had the line analised years ago?)

"Free the engines!" 

kevinfat wrote on 03/10/11 at 02:34:30:


The only site that doesn't allow computers is the uscf. ficgs, iccf, iecg, lss, netchess, and all the rest do.

@RenesDescartes: Well unlike you, my dear chessfrend, I actually play CC. What is it, I wonder, that gratifies you about wringing your hands over a pursuit in which you don't engage? I would have thought that so much rectitude would have been sufficient unto itself, without anyone's having to come here and pat himself on the back in a public forum on account of it.

Don't like CC? Fine, don't play it.

So is the concensus that only www.ficgs.com officially allows computers?

http://lss.chess-server.net/

This is a free server where you have cc with engines and if you want some engine free tournaments. It continues the iecg tournaments.

ReneDescartes wrote on 03/06/11 at 12:23:52:


In ICCF it's perfectly legal and there is no stigma attached to it.  Anyone is at liberty to play without computer assistance there as well.  I think it's a shame that those who wish to play without a computer have trouble doing so, but the prevalence of computers in CC attests to the greater popularity of this form of competition.  There is no effective way to police it, in my opinion, in any case.  I don't think that a very strong case has been made for using computers to detect computerized play.  When some of the chief practitioners of this came into this forum to defend it, they didn't seem to understand they statistical principles that would have to underly any attempt to do it.

USCF makes a big deal about banning computers, but when I played there, it was clear to me that many of my opponents were using them.  When I took up playing with computer assistance myself, I stopped playing CC on USCF.  However, I am rather sure that many others play there with computers.  If I'm not mistaken, there is a US player, with the CCIM title from ICCF, and who regularly plays CC on USCF and maintains a very high rating, yet who only took up chess in his 50s.  I just about fell out of my chair when that fact was reported, with a straight face so to speak, in Chess Life.  If he's not using a computer even on USCF I would be very surprised indeed; yet here is Chess Life, the Federation's journal, crowing about him.  But that's between him, his opponents and USCF; I'm not going to wring my hands over it.  

As I have said before, I do play with computer assistance in some venues where computers are banned but play is anonymous.  You can tell from the very high level of play by many players there, and their maintaining a very extensive list of ongoing games against strong opponents, that they're playing with computers.  Call me and these others cheats if you wish, but I can't see that it's skin off anyone's nose if "CaptainKidd" beats "SnowWhite" using a computer.  Nothing is at stake.  If SnowWhite doesn't want to play a pirate, she should go to a serious CC site and play under her real name.  

I know this point of view makes some people angry, and I frankly don't care.  I simply don't respect the rules of these crap anonymous CC sites enough to deprive myself of the opportunity to play the game I want to play.  When my opponent and I both play under our true names, then I do obey the rules, out of respect for him or her.  

Matemax wrote on 03/06/11 at 12:41:05:

That's not entirely true - only with a delay of three moves.

http://www.iccf.com/rules/ICCFTournamentRules01-01-2011.pdf

Article 11.

Several years ago Dutch federation NBC send a letter in which using computers in old-fashioned postal chess was forbidden, but ICCF seems to have not taken this over.