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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest? (Read 23519 times)
Rue-64
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #15 - 02/23/13 at 14:37:21
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chessy wrote on 03/23/11 at 19:32:15:
I am searching for more material to the oldbenoni.

just to be sure... I guess the Czech/oldbenoni is covered in the "nimzo and Benoni" section (and not in the "dearing defences" section?) right?

thx 4 help

you're right!
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #14 - 03/23/11 at 19:32:15
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I am searching for more material to the oldbenoni.

just to be sure... I guess the Czech/oldbenoni is covered in the "nimzo and Benoni" section (and not in the "dearing defences" section?) right?

thx 4 help
  
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George Jempty
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #13 - 03/10/11 at 10:09:38
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TonyRo wrote on 03/10/11 at 03:44:39:
Another thing to consider is that Black's knight hop ...Nd7-f8-g6 is most effective in the Bd3, Nf3, h3 system, as f4 is really the best square for this piece. This is usually combined with your other maneuver ...h5-h4, allowing ...Nh5-f4 and permanently stopping g3, and so on.

Here the knight maneuver is much less impressive, as it has no good squares from g6, and is rendered mostly useless. I don't remember exactly what Palliser recommends against the Fianchetto systems, but it's worth a look.

Martin recommends starting with the move order 5...Nbd7!?, such that you can meet g3 systems with ...g6 systems. White's natural plan here is to play Nge2 and f4, and this would allow ...exf4, unleashing the g7-bishop. Palliser is a bit pessimistic about Black's chances here because of Nf3 instead of Nge2, but you can be the judge for yourself. There's a lot of room for research and independent analysis in all of these lines.

Happy Hunting!


Yes I did notice after ...Ng6 my knight didn't have many prospects.  Unlike Martin, Palliser seems to think that ...g6 just leads to a version of the KID Fianchetto variation that is favorable to White.  I will have another look but I think he recommends following up ...Be7 with preparations for a Queenside break with ...Na6, ...Nc7, ...a6, ...Rb8, etcetera.  Here's a draw I found incorporating that plan from the 2003 Czech championship:

[Event "CZE-chT 0304"]
[Site "Czechia"]
[Date "2003.??.??"]
[Round "3"]
[White "Jurek, Josef"]
[Black "Langner, Ladislav"]
[Result "1/2-1/2"]
[ECO "A56"]
[WhiteElo "2335"]
[BlackElo "2400"]
[PlyCount "54"]
[EventDate "2003.10.??"]
[EventType "team-tourn"]
[EventRounds "11"]
[EventCountry "CZE"]
[Source "ChessBase"]
[SourceDate "2004.01.13"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 3. d5 e5 4. Nc3 d6 5. e4 Be7 6. g3 Na6 7. Bg2 Nc7 8. Nge2 a6
9. a4 b6 10. O-O Rb8 11. Qd3 O-O 12. f4 Nfe8 13. Be3 Bd7 14. Kh1 Bf6 15. Ra2 b5
16. axb5 axb5 17. b3 bxc4 18. bxc4 Na8 19. Rb1 Nec7 20. Bd2 Rb6 21. Nd1 Qb8 22.
Rxb6 Nxb6 23. Ne3 Qb7 24. Bf3 Ra8 25. Qb1 Rxa2 26. Qxa2 Bc8 27. Bc3 Qa6 1/2-1/2
  
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TonyRo
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #12 - 03/10/11 at 03:44:39
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Another thing to consider is that Black's knight hop ...Nd7-f8-g6 is most effective in the Bd3, Nf3, h3 system, as f4 is really the best square for this piece. This is usually combined with your other maneuver ...h5-h4, allowing ...Nh5-f4 and permanently stopping g3, and so on.

Here the knight maneuver is much less impressive, as it has no good squares from g6, and is rendered mostly useless. I don't remember exactly what Palliser recommends against the Fianchetto systems, but it's worth a look.

Martin recommends starting with the move order 5...Nbd7!?, such that you can meet g3 systems with ...g6 systems. White's natural plan here is to play Nge2 and f4, and this would allow ...exf4, unleashing the g7-bishop. Palliser is a bit pessimistic about Black's chances here because of Nf3 instead of Nge2, but you can be the judge for yourself. There's a lot of room for research and independent analysis in all of these lines.

Happy Hunting!
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #11 - 03/10/11 at 02:34:35
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I've come to the conclusion that White's simplest and best is g3, Bg2, Nge2, O-O and sooner or later f4.  I've discovered that this works pretty well in "quick chess."
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #10 - 03/10/11 at 01:51:23
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George Jempty wrote on 03/08/11 at 01:39:06:
kylemeister wrote on 03/06/11 at 00:17:09:
George Jempty wrote on 03/06/11 at 00:07:01:
However I am aware of another transpositional possibility because I used to play this way as White before adopting the 2. c3 Sicilian, and that is after Black accepts the Morra Gambit with 2...cxd4, White can play 3. Nf3 and a traditional open Sicilian will be reached after all.


Not really, because of 3...a6.  The Czech is traditionally reached via 1...Nf6, however.  Mainly a matter of whether Black prefers to allow the Trompovsky or the Old Benoni (in which White misses out c4, as they seem to say in the UK).

Oh, and The ABC of the Czech Benoni is a video.  (I see that this week's Martin video advocates the Cambridge Springs ...)


Right I'd googled for "ABCs of the Czech Benoni" and found that it was a video.  Maybe I'll get it after reading the Palliser book, which I just ordered today.


So I just received the book today and had barely thumbed through it, then I got a chance to play my first ever Czech Benoni!  It's no masterpiece, and White's play is certainly not critical due to his refusal to play e4, especially after 15...Kh8? and then 16...Bd8?  Then I miss 18...Ne5! but Black blunders with 20. Qd4?? and resigns before I get to play 28...Nxh4.  Despite the glaring imperfections, getting a win in my first try will definitely encourage me to keep trying, and maybe I will eventually get the hang of it. Thanks everybody for their encouragement!

[Event "ICC"]
[Site "Internet Chess Club"]
[Date "2011.03.09"]
[White "sicilianfan"]
[Black "theoryschmeory"]
[Result "0-1"]
[WhiteElo "1577"]
[BlackElo "1528"]
[TimeControl "900+0"]

1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 c5 3. d5 e5 4. Nc3 d6 5. g3 Be7
6. Bg2 Nbd7 7. Nf3 Nf8 8. O-O Ng6 9. a3 h5 10. h4 Bg4
11. b4 cxb4 12. axb4 Qd7 13. Kh2 O-O 14. Qc2 Rfc8 15. Qd3 Kh8
16. Ng5 Bd8 17. Nb5 e4 18. Bxe4 Nxe4 19. Qxe4 Bf5 20. Qd4 Bf6
21. Qd2 Bxa1 22. Nxd6 Rf8 23. Ndxf7+ Rxf7 24. Nxf7+ Qxf7 25. Bb2 Bxb2
26. Qxb2 Rc8 27. Rd1 Rxc4 28. d6
0-1
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #9 - 03/09/11 at 12:37:33
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TonyRo wrote on 03/08/11 at 13:08:07:
There are also quite a few games by Larsen, if you're interested in the ...g6 and ...Bg7 approach, although White should be somewhat better there.

As far as heroes go for this line, Miladinovic, Nisipeanu, Aronian, and Seirawan come to my mind first, but perhaps there are others.


Thanks, I did hear Martin mention Nisipeanu in a snippet about the Czech Benoni in a YouTube video.

As for Larsen's approach with ...g6 and ...Bg7, further research by me has revealed this was Petrosian's approach as well
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #8 - 03/08/11 at 13:08:07
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There are also quite a few games by Larsen, if you're interested in the ...g6 and ...Bg7 approach, although White should be somewhat better there.

As far as heroes go for this line, Miladinovic, Nisipeanu, Aronian, and Seirawan come to my mind first, but perhaps there are others.
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #7 - 03/08/11 at 06:22:19
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kylemeister wrote on 03/08/11 at 03:32:27:
I'm afraid the one I most readily think of involved him getting rolled up by Gligoric ...


Not a Petrosian game, but L'Ami-Aronian is one recent high-level test that didn't turn out well for Black.
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #6 - 03/08/11 at 03:32:27
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I'm afraid the one I most readily think of involved him getting rolled up by Gligoric ...
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #5 - 03/08/11 at 01:39:06
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kylemeister wrote on 03/06/11 at 00:17:09:
George Jempty wrote on 03/06/11 at 00:07:01:
However I am aware of another transpositional possibility because I used to play this way as White before adopting the 2. c3 Sicilian, and that is after Black accepts the Morra Gambit with 2...cxd4, White can play 3. Nf3 and a traditional open Sicilian will be reached after all.


Not really, because of 3...a6.  The Czech is traditionally reached via 1...Nf6, however.  Mainly a matter of whether Black prefers to allow the Trompovsky or the Old Benoni (in which White misses out c4, as they seem to say in the UK).

Oh, and The ABC of the Czech Benoni is a video.  (I see that this week's Martin video advocates the Cambridge Springs ...)


Right I'd googled for "ABCs of the Czech Benoni" and found that it was a video.  Maybe I'll get it after reading the Palliser book, which I just ordered today.

I'm finding that, of World Champions, Tigran Petrosian played the Czech Benoni quite a bit.  Am hoping there are some games of his in the book.  If not and/or in the meantime, can anybody point me to any especially important Petrosian games with the Czech Benoni?
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #4 - 03/06/11 at 01:40:30
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I suggest the Tarrasch Defence. It's easy to play, active, and there's a great book about to be released on it.  Wink
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #3 - 03/06/11 at 00:17:09
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George Jempty wrote on 03/06/11 at 00:07:01:
However I am aware of another transpositional possibility because I used to play this way as White before adopting the 2. c3 Sicilian, and that is after Black accepts the Morra Gambit with 2...cxd4, White can play 3. Nf3 and a traditional open Sicilian will be reached after all.


Not really, because of 3...a6.  The Czech is traditionally reached via 1...Nf6, however.  Mainly a matter of whether Black prefers to allow the Trompovsky or the Old Benoni (in which White misses out c4, as they seem to say in the UK).

Oh, and The ABC of the Czech Benoni is a video.  (I see that this week's Martin video advocates the Cambridge Springs ...)
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #2 - 03/06/11 at 00:07:01
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TonyRo wrote on 03/05/11 at 23:53:41:
It's not clear to me that the parallels you alude to make sense with regards to fitting the Czech Benoni in to your repertoire, but I quite like it regardless. It's a solid choice that gives a player with strong understanding of the plans and structures ample time and opportunity to whamboozle less experienced White players.

Palliser's book is a great choice, as is Martin's ABC's of the Czech Benoni. Normally I'm not a huge fan of his work, but this one is a gem.

Happy Hunting!


Thanks for the other book recommendation.  It just struck me, that if I play the immediate 1...c5 against 1. d4, I need to be prepared for a transposition to the Morra Gambit vs. the Sicilian via 2. e4.  I don't play the Sicilian, but I do play 2. c3 against it, and so if faced with the Morra via transposition after 1. d4 c5  2. e4, I could always play 2...cxd4  3. c3 Nf6  4. e5 Nd5 reaching a position from the 2. c3 Sicilian I am accustomed to as White, which in my experience, is a good way to learn your openings: playing both sides.

However I am aware of another transpositional possibility because I used to play this way as White before adopting the 2. c3 Sicilian, and that is after Black accepts the Morra Gambit with 2...cxd4, White can play 3. Nf3 and a traditional open Sicilian will be reached after all.  So I guess if one plays 1...c5 against 1. d4 they must be prepared to defend a Sicilian though only against an opponent who transposes at practically every move Wink
  
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Re: Czech Benoni instead of the Budapest?
Reply #1 - 03/05/11 at 23:53:41
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It's not clear to me that the parallels you alude to make sense with regards to fitting the Czech Benoni in to your repertoire, but I quite like it regardless. It's a solid choice that gives a player with strong understanding of the plans and structures ample time and opportunity to whamboozle less experienced White players.

Palliser's book is a great choice, as is Martin's ABC's of the Czech Benoni. Normally I'm not a huge fan of his work, but this one is a gem.

Happy Hunting!
  
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