(UTC)
Latest Updates:
  ChessPub Forum › Chess Publishing Openings › King's Indian › Best King's Indian attack book?
(Moderators: Bibs, trw)
‹ Previous Topic | Next Topic ›
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 
Topic Tools
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Best King's Indian attack book? (Read 45709 times)
MNb
God Member
*****
Offline


Rudolf Spielmann forever

Posts: 10757
Location: Moengo
Joined: 01/05/04
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #38 - 09/25/21 at 05:59:40
Post Tools
I love it that NM Ramirez, like many sources, neither looks at 1.e4 e6 2.d3 c5 nor at 1.Nf3 e6 2.g3 f5.
  
The book had the effect good books usually have: it made the stupids more stupid, the intelligent more intelligent and the other thousands of readers remained unchanged.
GC Lichtenberg
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
dpcjsr
YaBB Newbies
*
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 4
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Joined: 06/20/21
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #37 - 09/25/21 at 04:37:01
Post Tools
I would just like to add that YouTube has a series of videos by Robert Ramirez that covers the KIA but he adds several very interesting new ideas. Worth a look.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Nickajack
Junior Member
**
Offline


Yabba Dabba Doo!

Posts: 57
Location: USA
Joined: 02/21/17
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #36 - 03/10/17 at 04:10:59
Post Tools
BobbyDigital80 wrote on 03/09/17 at 11:10:13:
Nickajack wrote on 03/08/17 at 02:22:59:
TD wrote on 03/07/17 at 07:16:22:
Why is this posted under "King's Indian"?

Why not? It has a lot in common with the KID, albeit with reversed colors.


A lot of openings are similar to other ones with reversed colors. But if we lumped them all together then you'd have the English with the Sicilian, the Caro-Kann exchange variation with the Queen's Gambit exchange, the Nimzo-Larsen Attack with the Queen's Indian, the Colle with the Semi-Slav, the Catalan with the Grunfeld, etc.



Fair enough. Smiley
  
Dubious, therefore playable Undecided
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Paddy
God Member
*****
Offline


The truth will out!

Posts: 964
Location: Manchester
Joined: 01/10/03
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #35 - 03/09/17 at 14:36:08
Post Tools
JEH wrote on 03/24/07 at 17:01:47:
OK, fair point, Jenny and Ptero.

Well from the White games of Fisher in Mega 2007, there are less than 20 with him going Nf3 and into a KIA, and all but a couple of simul games are from 56-57.

There are only 3 total from him using the KIA vs the French after that period, '66 vs Durao, '67 vs Myagmurson and '68 vs Geller. Superb displays of his skill though they are, that is it.

There are more examples of him using it against the Caro-Kann, but still single digits.

So my point is that after his teens, Fisher didn't emply the KIA except as a very occasional surprise weapon.


The explanation is that in his early career Fischer opened with 1 Nf3. he then switched to 1 e4, after which he used the KIA only as an occasional weapon against 1...e6, 1...c5 2 Nf3 e6 and 1...c6.

Dvoretsky's article is a great introduction, covering a wide range of thematic ideas.

BTW I rate highly the book on the KIA by IM Eric Tangborn (for Kindle), which has a great collection of games and pretty good annotations.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
BobbyDigital80
Senior Member
****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 355
Joined: 05/15/08
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #34 - 03/09/17 at 11:10:13
Post Tools
Nickajack wrote on 03/08/17 at 02:22:59:
TD wrote on 03/07/17 at 07:16:22:
Why is this posted under "King's Indian"?

Why not? It has a lot in common with the KID, albeit with reversed colors.


A lot of openings are similar to other ones with reversed colors. But if we lumped them all together then you'd have the English with the Sicilian, the Caro-Kann exchange variation with the Queen's Gambit exchange, the Nimzo-Larsen Attack with the Queen's Indian, the Colle with the Semi-Slav, the Catalan with the Grunfeld, etc.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Sandman
Full Member
***
Offline



Posts: 134
Joined: 05/10/07
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #33 - 03/08/17 at 18:55:13
Post Tools
There have been more responses on which forum the topic should be in than responses on the actual topic.

ps: I think it should be in Flank openings.
  
“All it takes is one bad day to reduce the sanest man alive to lunacy.
That's how far the world is from where I am.
Just one bad day.”
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
barnaby
Senior Member
****
Offline


The night is dark and
full of terrors.

Posts: 345
Joined: 01/09/12
Gender: Female
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #32 - 03/08/17 at 15:39:48
Post Tools
Nickajack wrote on 03/08/17 at 02:22:59:
TD wrote on 03/07/17 at 07:16:22:
Why is this posted under "King's Indian"?

Why not? It has a lot in common with the KID, albeit with reversed colors.



Because it is not a King's Indian defense, that is why.

It is a completely different opening that does not even come out of 1.d4 systems.

The Flank Openings section should be slightly expanded to include offbeat, miscellaneous openings and it should be sent there.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
chk
God Member
*****
Offline


a pawn is a pawn

Posts: 1063
Location: Athens
Joined: 10/26/06
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #31 - 03/08/17 at 13:49:10
Post Tools
I propose that for the time being and for practical reasons (searches etc.), this thread is moved to the flank openings, since most threads discussing KIA can be found there.
  
"I play honestly and I play to win. If I lose, I take my medicine." - Bobby
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Nickajack
Junior Member
**
Offline


Yabba Dabba Doo!

Posts: 57
Location: USA
Joined: 02/21/17
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #30 - 03/08/17 at 02:22:59
Post Tools
TD wrote on 03/07/17 at 07:16:22:
Why is this posted under "King's Indian"?

Why not? It has a lot in common with the KID, albeit with reversed colors.
  
Dubious, therefore playable Undecided
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
TN
God Member
*****
Offline



Posts: 3420
Joined: 11/07/08
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #29 - 03/07/17 at 13:43:17
Post Tools
AcuWill wrote on 02/03/07 at 13:56:07:
I'm looking for a book for someone new to the opening but willing to work and isn't shy of heavy reading and thinking.  I would rank my skill level as a sharply rising lower to mid club level player.  I would like a book heavy in explanations to the thought process rather than heavy on variations.  Thanks.


It depends what interpretation you're going for; are you starting with e4, going for Nf3/g3/Bg2/0-0/d3/e4/Nbd2, Nf3/g3/Bg2/c4 or lines with d4?

There have already been some good book recommendations, so I'll propose looking through Amin's games - he's been playing the KIA the 'system opening' way for nearly his whole life. Kramnik's games are great value too, if you're willing to transpose into certain English/d4 systems with c4/d4, although you'll probably find them a bit nuanced for your current level.
  
All our dreams come true if we have the courage to pursue them.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Michael Ayton
God Member
*****
Offline


‘You’re never alone with
a doppelgänger.’

Posts: 1947
Location: durham
Joined: 04/19/03
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #28 - 03/07/17 at 11:07:08
Post Tools
Most KIA lines are best thought of as arising from 1 Nf3, I agree, but a few aren't. And with (anti-)French lines, for example, I guess you could make arguments both ways. Does the table below (showing most of the 'Reversed' lines first) help?

*****


King’s Indian Attack: Defences

Reversed KID, Classical [KID Reversed]

Reversed KID, Seirawan System [Karpov System]

Reversed KID, e3/Nf3 [‘Main Line’ (A08)]

Reversed KID, main-line Fianchetto [KID Reversed]      

Reversed KID, Fianchetto with e3/Ne2 [Kasparov System]

Reversed King’s Indian Attack

Reversed English, Closed (Nc3/Nf3/g3/Bg2/d3)

Reversed English, Botvinnik System (Nc3/Ne2/g3/Bg2/e4)

Reversed English, Bremen System (Nc3/Ne2/g3/Bg2/e3)

Reversed English ((Nc3)/Nf3/e3/Be2)

Reversed English (Nc3/Nf3/e4/Be2) [Czech Benoni line (A04/B30)]

Reversed Pirc, Classical

Reversed Pirc, Fianchetto with Nf3

Reversed Pirc, Fianchetto with Ne2 [Pachman Variation]

Reversed Pirc, Dolmatov System [Dolmatov System]

Reversed Torre Attack [Keres System]

Reversed London System [Lasker System]      

+++++

Caro-Kann/KIA (A04), 1 e4 c6 2 d3 e5 3 Nf3 d6 4 g3 g6 5 Bg2 Bg7 6 0-0 Ne7

Caro-Kann/KIA (A05), 1 e4 c6 2 d3 e5 3 Nf3 d6 4 g3 g6 5 Bg2 Bg7 6 0-0 Nf6

Caro-Kann/Petroff (C42), 1 e4 c6 2 d3 e5 3 Nf3 d6 4 g3 Nf6 5 Bg2 Be7

French/Reversed Philidor, 1 e4 e6 2 d3 d5 3 Nd2 Nc6 4 Ngf3 Nc6 (C00)

French/Reversed Philidor, 1 e4 e6 2 d3 d5 3 Nd2 Nf6 4 Ngf3 (4 g3) b6 (C00)

Hedgehog (...c5/…b6/…e6) (A04)

Hedgehog (...c5/…b6/…g6) (A04)

Queen’s Indian Defence line (…b6/…e6 [RR …c5]) (A05)

Spassky Variation (A05)
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JonathanB
Senior Member
****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 449
Location: London
Joined: 11/17/07
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #27 - 03/07/17 at 11:06:43
Post Tools
Ptero wrote on 03/24/07 at 15:40:35:
Also not from Fischer's "teens", I recall Fischer-Geller, 1968 (1-0) (that's Uzi Geller, veteran Israeli master and former Israeli Champion - not to be confused with Efim Geller) as a model KIA game.



JEH’s point stands in general even if there are exceptions.

Fischer gave up the KIA because it’s not very good. We know this because we know that chess just isn’t the kind of game where you can succeed by  playing the same thing over and over regardless of how the opponent plays.

That it’s not very good (objectively) doesn’t mean we shouldn’t play it, of course. I suspect most of us are more equivalent to Fischer in his teens than Fischer in his later life in terms of our chess development.

Anyway, I wonder if the OP is still around and still playing the KIA.
  
www.streathambrixtonchess.blogspot.com  "I don't call you f**k face" - GM Nigel Short.
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
JEH
God Member
*****
Offline


"Football is like Chess,
only without the dice."

Posts: 1456
Location: Reading
Joined: 09/22/05
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #26 - 03/07/17 at 09:45:12
Post Tools
ArKheiN wrote on 03/07/17 at 09:05:42:
It should be under 1.Nf3 because many KIA come from the Reti with e4 instead of c4.


I agree, it should come under flank openings as most of the Sicilian and French lines can transpose from 1. Nf3
  
Those who want to go by my perverse footsteps play such pawn structure with fuzzy atypical still strategic orientations

Clowns to the left of me, jokers to the right, stuck in the middlegame with you
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
ArKheiN
God Member
*****
Offline


I love ChessPublishing.com!

Posts: 728
Location: Belgium
Joined: 03/30/05
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #25 - 03/07/17 at 09:05:42
Post Tools
It should be under 1.Nf3 because many KIA come from the Reti with e4 instead of c4.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Confused_by_Theory
God Member
*****
Offline


I Love ChessPublishing!

Posts: 649
Location: Europe
Joined: 05/13/15
Gender: Male
Re: Best King's Indian attack book?
Reply #24 - 03/07/17 at 08:57:37
Post Tools
Hello.
TD wrote on 03/07/17 at 07:16:22:
Why is this posted under "King's Indian"?
GMTonyKosten wrote on 03/07/17 at 08:37:25:
Yes, it obviously shouldn't be, but where should I move it to? It can arise from a French, ...e6 Sicilian, Réti, and many other openings. Maybe I should start a new sub-section under the French or Anti-Sicilians?
Suggestions are welcome!

French section subforum sounds mot natural to me.

Many Anti-Sicilian KIA's would be able to be discussed in the Closed Sicilian forum. Non-c5 KIA's shouldn't really be discussed on a Sicilian forum on the other hand; therefore French forum seems more reasonable.

Have a nice day.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: [1] 2 3 
Topic Tools
‹ Previous Topic | Next Topic ›
Bookmarks: del.icio.us Digg Facebook Google Google+ Linked in reddit StumbleUpon Twitter Yahoo
 
  « Board Index ‹ Board Top  

ChessPub Forum » Powered by YaBB 2.6.12!
YaBB Forum Software © 2000-2024. All Rights Reserved.

Valid RSS Valid XHTML Valid CSS Powered by Perl Source Forge