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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) The Tarrasch in Black and White (Read 60910 times)
Ametanoitos
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #297 - 08/01/10 at 08:16:00
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I was looking at a not-updated file from the time we were having this discusion here. In the manuscript i see 8.g3 Be7 9.h3 Ne4 and 9.Bg2 Ng4 as we had discussed it here.

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19.Kf1! with the idea Rg1-Kg2-Kh1
 
That is the position we looked up. It's just a matter of opinion. Black has enough comp because of the pawn-structure. White has to be really carefull because there are many tactical tricks here.

I have to say that these positions we are discusing here are WAY beyong known theory and i don't expect from my book to solve all the problems. I just wanted to offer some possible solutions as a food for thought and start a discusion. Also the book aims at club level and is not meant to satisfy the ambitious corr players.
  
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #296 - 08/01/10 at 08:01:37
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Ametanoitos wrote on 07/31/10 at 23:13:01:
Do you mean 9.Na4?

Yes
  

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MatrixX
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #295 - 08/01/10 at 07:08:03
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after 15.Qb2 Re8 16.Be2 there is no Rad8 because of the bishop, so i dont know which variation do you mean, but for example 15...Bg4 16.e3 Bxf3 17.gxf3 Re8 18.Be2 Rad8 now i like 19.Kf1! with the idea Rg1-Kg2-Kh1
by the way, most of my analysis i do/have done with two ambitious IMs making it a bit more human and proofing the comps evaluations, i think its the same like you do normally Wink Wink

after 8...Rc8 my analysis went with 9.h3 but i have to say that the analysis from stefan buecker starting with 9.Na4 is very strong. I couldn't figure out yet a relevant improvement for Black and at the end of his line white seems just better.
But if you can improve Black, we could discuss a little bit 9.h3 Wink

greetings!
  

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Ametanoitos
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #294 - 07/31/10 at 23:13:01
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Do you mean 9.Na4?
  
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #293 - 07/31/10 at 22:18:41
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Ametanoitos wrote on 07/31/10 at 16:47:39:
OK, i should probably not be so hursh with you, i apologize. My analysis starts with 8.g3 Rc8 and if 9.Bg2 Ng4= That's why i think that 7...Be6 should be played (and not Markovic's 7...Be7)


Now I'm afraid that the line given by stefan (Na4)is very difficult as black
  

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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #292 - 07/31/10 at 18:14:11
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MatrixX wrote on 07/31/10 at 12:32:50:
well ok not dangerous is to much, after 8.Qa4 Be7 9.Rd1 0-0 10.a3! i have no clear route to equality for black, but i have the feeling that 8.g3 is even more critical. So for the moment i'm not sure if 6...Nf6 is a solution, but let's see your analysis Wink

  10.a3! Qc8!?
  

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Ametanoitos
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #291 - 07/31/10 at 16:47:39
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OK, i should probably not be so hursh with you, i apologize. My analysis starts with 8.g3 Rc8 and if 9.Bg2 Ng4= That's why i think that 7...Be6 should be played (and not Markovic's 7...Be7)
  
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #290 - 07/31/10 at 16:23:01
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An IM friend emailed me about this 15.Qb2 variation and according to him after 15...Re8 16.Be2 Rad8 Black is fine.

My friend, as i always do in this foroum, i will first ask you to post your analysis to persuade us that Black has problems (there is a lot of analysis published here by other members you can use) and after that i'll post my analysis. I have to remind you that i write a book in the Tarrasch and i don't want to publish every line it's in it!
  
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MatrixX
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #289 - 07/31/10 at 12:32:50
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well ok not dangerous is to much, after 8.Qa4 Be7 9.Rd1 0-0 10.a3! i have no clear route to equality for black, but i have the feeling that 8.g3 is even more critical. So for the moment i'm not sure if 6...Nf6 is a solution, but let's see your analysis Wink
  

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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #288 - 07/30/10 at 17:33:50
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some analyse in the Nf6's line:

[Event "chesspub"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2010.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Analyse, Dji"]
[Black "at, a"]
[Result "*"]
[ECO "D32"]
[Annotator " Dji"]
[PlyCount "44"]

1. d4 d5 2. c4 e6 3. Nc3 c5 4. cxd5 exd5 5. Nf3 Nc6 6. dxc5 Nf6 7. Be3 Be7 as Markovich point out pobably more precise 8.g3 O-O 9. Bg2 Ng4  10. Nxd5! 
(10. Qxd5 Nxe3 11. fxe3 Be6 12.Qxd8 Raxd8)
(10. Bd4 Nxd4 11. Nxd4 Bxc5 12. e3 Qg5) 
(10. Bf4 Bxc5 11. O-O Be612. e3 Nf6 13. Rc1 Bd6 14. Bxd6 Qxd6) 
10... Nxe3 11. Nxe3 Bxc5 12. Qxd8 Rxd8 13. O-O Re8 14. Rac1 Rxe3 15. Rxc5 Rxe2 16. Re1Rxe1+ 17. Nxe1 Bd7 18. Rd5 Be6 19. Rb5 Re8 20. Nd3 Nd8 21. Re5 f6 22. Ra5 a6 unclear

[
  

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Ametanoitos
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #287 - 07/30/10 at 17:31:59
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Why do you think that 8.Qa4 is not dangerous? Can you post something concrete? I'll post the analysis when i have the chance to be at my laptop where i have my files.
  
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MatrixX
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #286 - 07/30/10 at 16:26:52
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i think also that black has some practical long term chances, but in correspondance chess i wouldn't be satisfied with black's position. A pawn is a pawn and white should be able to profit from his material advantage. So for the moment i wouldn't declare 6...d4 7...Bxc5 as a solution for black as also 9.Bd2 poses problems to black.

6...Nf6 seems interesting. Can you please post your solution to 7.Be3 Be6 8.g3! (i dont think 8.Qa4 is that good for white.)
  

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Ametanoitos
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #285 - 07/30/10 at 13:54:24
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I don't think that here Black's best bet is to focus on the White king. Black has long term chances in many endgames with Q+K Vs Q+B (with maybe a Rook each)+broken pawnstructure. I don't have time to analyse this now too deep but in general it seems unclear to me. If i come up with something more concrete i'll post it. In general the idea for White is very very rare and a better solution is 6...Nf6! (Kotronias has come with the same conclusion with me).
  
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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #284 - 07/30/10 at 12:04:43
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yes, this could maybe give black some chances against white king. I had analysed there: 20.Rg1 g6 21.Qe5 Rfe8 22.Rd1
  

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Re: The Tarrasch in Black and White
Reply #283 - 07/30/10 at 12:00:45
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After 15.Qb2! a5 16.b5 Bg4 17.e3 Ff3 18.gf3 Ne7 19.Be2 Rac8 Maybe the withe's king and pawn around give black some compensation but i'm not sure enough
  

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La victoire est brillante mais l'échec est mat!  Coluche
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