Bibs wrote on 03/29/21 at 07:26:24:


I have experience with pgn-spy, so I can have a look, but it's unlikely a 5-games sample is enough to reach solid conclusions for a player at this level. 

I wasn't able to locate a pgn of the games though ?! Could someone help locate it ?

Bibs wrote on 03/29/21 at 03:50:39:


Thanks very much for bringing that scandal to my attention, a very curious case indeed. I have not analysed any of the games as yet so cannot reach any conclusions, but a few observations:

1. There needs to be more transparency, it is ludicrous to disqualify players deny them any right of appeal, claiming fair play violations but not necessarily cheating violations. This goes against all the laws of natural justice.

2. Cheating in Rapid Chess with an engine is more difficult to pull off simply due to the time control. Not impossible though, see the Tigran Petrosian case.

3. The panel claims to have physical evidence supporting their verdict of fair play violations, if that is the case they need to disclose it.

4. The panel claims to have "Host internet platform (HIP)" evidence to support their claim of fair play violations, again they need to disclose exactly what this is and how the disqualified players are involved.

As it stands I sympathise with the players plight based on what has been presented thus far, which seems a lot like railroading and abuse of authority to me. Let's hope more comes to light in the coming weeks to clarify this situation.

First, I find it simply disingenuous to say someone was disqualified for fair play violations, but that does not mean it was "actual" cheating.

I played through the Iulija Osmak games and it seems inconclusive to me. She played a lot of very good moves, but she certainly did not play any crazy "engine move". Sure, she played great and her opponents did not, but at least two of her opponents put themselves in time pressure pretty early. In another one she was behind early but just managed the clock better. Overall her time usage makes sense for human play. Maybe things just went her way and she was never under pressure. Or maybe she cheated. She only played 174 moves in the five games, it's pretty slim evidence statistically.

Jupp53 wrote on 03/28/21 at 10:22:55:


The problem is not with Corr chess, or Engine Chess the problem is that many players are not interested in having Engine assisted vs Engine Assisted contest, the problem is they want to use Engine assistance against fellow players to boost their results and ego while pretending they are not and when they get caught they cry and bleat and complain and deny and make excuses and beg for mercy and understanding and forgiveness. I would forgive them but only after a life ban was imposed, the only way I would consider not imposing a life ban  was if a cheater volunteeringly came forward before being caught and confessed his crimes.

Results, prestige, medals, validation once stolen is difficult and in some cases impossible to restore. I see exposure and life bans as important remedies to have at one's disposal in dealing with this scourge along with the stripping of any held titles etc. of course.

Dividing this is the problem. It will become more and more difficult in consequence of the technical development.

Chess otb without electronical help.
Correspondence chess with all technical support allowed.
Centaur tournaments.

These are three easy and clear cut ways and everybody interested in each of it is imo a serious lover of the game. 

Chess.com and Lichess suffer from the idea to be able to stop engine use in correspondence chess. They are able to detect it often. But it will be always a game of hide and seek with changing winners. I don't know it exactly. But I assume on my level FIDE 2000~ it is meanwhile easy to detect engine use till rapid time control and secure enough till classic time controls.

So most games are secure enough. The problem is more difficult if top levels are touched. Maybe I'm too indolent. What do I care about football players taking drugs? What do I care about bicycle tours accompagnied by well known doping helpers?

The below comments were made by one of our more controversial members in a by now infamous and locked thread. Nevertheless, while I agree that many of his posts are combative, some of his points still remain salient:

"(5) After Kasparov lost to Depp Blue in 1997, it became clear that humans should play humans and computers should play computers. Point is, a machine has a database programmed and can think faster, while a human cannot.  Likewise, the prevalence of chess engines has taken a lot of fun out of correspondence chess. This is because some 1500 can use a chess engine to win games, with people being none the wiser.

(6) I have seen chess sites where cheaters have been banned by the thousands. Why do you think I am distrustful of correspondence chess to a certain extent? Because there is the possibility that you are not playing against a human but against his computer!!

So, there you have my responses. If you want to play me in an OTB  game, say G/30 on Internet Chess Club or some other site, let me know.

Thank you for your attention."

Point 6 is particularly troubling as FIDE is about to introduce so called hybrid tournaments, where players will be able to compete for 'OTB' IM & GM norms. Online engine cheating has already spiralled out of control and I shudder to think what the implications of introducing 'Hybrid' rated tournaments will mean for the integrity of our game.

The CEO of Chess.com, IM Danny Rensch has stated that if people knew not only how rampant but also who engaged in online cheating it would shock them to the core. Many caught  cheaters still enjoy anonymity, and in my opinion that needs to change if online tournaments are to stand any chance of legitimacy. 

Some of the titled players that have been caught and banned: Tal Baron; Tigran Petrosian; Akshat Chandra; Maxim Dlugy; Igors Rausis; Nigalidze Georgiadis; Sébastien Feller <--- (This guy should have been banned for life for sure) In general the punishment for offenders continues to be way too slight, so until that changes the cheating trend will continue to rise. By the way the number of GM's and IM's that have been caught cheating in Titled Tuesday and other online events is scary according to Danny Rensch, and it's not isolated to any one Gender, for instance if anyone deserves a life ban it would be Patrycja Waszczuk  see full story here:  https://chess24.com/en/read/news/17-year-old-european-chess-champion-gets-2-year...

We simply must stop coddling these serial offenders.